56 replies to this topic

[mildImp]

Ive started this mod inforce and, although I haven't made if very far, have a couple of comments. First, the transition pts from the forest east of Pedville(sp?) can be difficult to find. I actually had to look at the are files for some of the outdoor areas to figure out how to proceed. Specifically finding the transition to DSC007 from DSC004 was difficult even after aquiring the coordinates.

The other comment that I would make so far is I love the combat with the higher level undead in these areas (I actually had to use some of those restoration scrolls Ive been stockpiling). However, due to the high levels that most players will achieve at this point in BP, I would argue for more undead. Have them run in packs. The honest truth is that Jet can destroy most of them outright anyway.

[Sir BillyBob]

The move from Peldvale(?) to the Forest of Forgotten Souls should be easier with the updated 1.0 mod. I added a worldmap and removed the actual travel triggers. Did you try to move to the edge of the map to open the worldmap? You do still need to find the transition points between the three outdoor maps for this area. I guess I can look into making map points like I did for BoneHill.

Area DSC007 should just be a matter of finding the dark hole in the side of the ridge. Nothing fancy here. I can see about making the trigger larger if that helps.

I haven't added any scripts to these areas for harder fights. Could be done, just haven't thought about it before.

[mildImp]

The move from Pedville was a snap, its transitioning beteeen the other areas that has been a little challenging. Also, Are you supposed to be able to get into the abandoned shack in DSC002 the first time around, cause I could not find a way in.


[EDIT]
Took a look at the area script, I guess not. Looks like there is a global that neeeds to be set.

Edited by mildImp, 04 November 2004 - 11:56 AM.

[mildImp]

Ok, Im lost. Been to 001, 002, 004 (the cave and house from that area). What do I do next? Cant seem to get into 003 (the house from 002). Help!

[Sir BillyBob]

You have to talk to the phantom (one will run up to you). He/It will tell you about the Dark One. After you fight with the Dark One, he will resurrect. At this point, the phantom will get around to telling you that you need a lich jar which is inside the cabin. Once you get the lich jar, you can now kill the Dark One (lich). Otherwise, I have him resurrect about 4 times before he gives up on you and finally dies. The containers inside are locked and guarded! But you can fight him with some team members while the others get the jar.

The cabin door will not be open until that second talk with the phantom. He should follow you during your fight but if you move too fast, he may get left behind. In which case, you won't get the second dialog and the open door.

[mildImp]

Thanks BB. I finally read the README file and figured out where to find Jet's sister so I could move on with the plot.

The battle with the dark one was one of the hardest yet. It was awesome on "insane" level. I had to run it like 6x to finally kill him with out perminantly lossing a critical team member. His skeleton warriors kept chunking Vicky.

BTW, he ressurrects so quickly, I had to fight him all 4x and then go talk to the phantom. There was never a moment when I wasnt engaged with him to go talk to the phantom and even if there had been, I just don't think I would have thought to (without having read the walkthrough first). I enjoyed the fight, but the intended sequence flow is just not supported by the timing and story line, IMO.

Final comment, and this has been discussed in the BP forum, but I just thought Id mention that I experienced my first "gating" experience in this game with this current version of BP and it definately left me unfullfilled. The dark one opened a gate and several demons (4 I think) stepped through and promptly started attacking each other, even with my party 5 ft away. I had read the "Baatezu vs Tanar'ri" thread and hadn't really given it much thought, but I have to agree that the actions of the Baatezu seem unrealistic or at least self defeating. Im going to look at how to change this behavior for my game.

[Sir BillyBob]

Normally you would only have him resurrect once. You would then have the jar, and be able to kill him permanently the second time. I don't think I even have him gate in demons until that third or fourth resurrect. So you have definitely tested beyond what I expected. Maybe it is best that the demons fight each other, I couldn't imagine a party of level 6 or 7 being able to defeat 4 demons!

One short-cut to try is to let him teleport away and cast his skull traps. At that point, he is normally just standing there waiting for you to attack again. If you put your time into getting the jar instead of going after him, this will give you time to heal team members and start over. Otherwise, with a split team it is harder to fight him and he will resurrect again.

[mildImp]

Yeah, I can see how this encounter could be made much easier through these tactics. I guess what im saying is that the way the encounter behaves today, I just dont think the uneducated player would have enough info or storyline direction to know thats what they should do next. Im not sure how to solve this issue, but if I didnt know what I know now about talking to the phantom to open the abandoned shack door and going to get the jar, I would run the encounter the way I did and keep attacking the dark one until he stopped resurrecting. Especially, given the speed and location with which he respawns. You kill him and he's back and in your face. The encounter doesnt lend itself to the player thinking, "hmmm...maybe I should go talk to the phantom again, because I killed the dark one". I guess, ultimately my issue is with the continuity of game play rather than tactics.

Whatever, I really like the challange of the combat with the 4 incarnations of ol darky and I really liked that each time I killed him he came back stronger.

BTW, I totally agree that its a good thing the Demon's attack each other (I was totally fubared on that attempt at combat anyway) my party is currently 7-9th level and has some big guns, but I didnt even hit any of the demons once. :help:

[EDIT]
Just a thought - What if after you kill him the first time, the darkone doesnt resurrect until after you enter the abandoned house? Or, maybe he doesn't return for 24 hrs? I dont know....somthing like that.

Edited by mildImp, 05 November 2004 - 01:16 PM.

[Sir BillyBob]

I thought about some of those ideas also. The problem is that if you wait 24 hours, the party wouldn't stick around anyway (since they wouldn't know about this) and a new player would think they are done.

The door opens as soon as the phantom tells you about it. I guess the problem with this is that the phantom may not be next to you to tell you this. What about the idea of a shout dialog where the phantom can be anywhere on the map but still tells you about the jar? Don't completely logical but it would always allow the player to know about the door.

[hlidskialf]

Since when does life have all the easy answers given to you? :nana:

[mildImp]

Just finished the forest dragon quest. The encounter was not as fun as the dark one. I actually ran through the encounter several times and encountered some weirdness. For the most part the dragon was kicking my ass, however on one occasion He just died. I didnt even get a hit off according to my console. He just cast dragon fear and then a wing buffet (knocking us all over the map) and then he promptly died (although there was no indication about how he took damage). One time the dragon died after one hit from Imoen (although she did have the dragon slaying arrows I looted from the halfling, so thats understandable). Once I beat the dragon going toe to toe with my fighters.

My next comment is in regards to the encounter with Kourison(sp?) when entering Nashkel after killing the dragon. This encounter was kind of lame. I mean the fight wasnt easy, but only because of all the protection spells and that overpowered Acid sword. My main beef was that Kourison just stood there through the whole encounter. He never tried to attack even after I took down his protections. I wish he would have fought back. Was this intentional or a bug? That sword has got to go too. Its just way too powerful IMHO. Im going to sell it.

Finally, as I left the dragon area, some guy told me that the mayor of Nashkel was ill or something and I read from the walkthrough that Im supposed to have some encounter with a little girl? However, I never ran into her. Talked to Jeremy and went back to Beregost to give the relic back to Blane, but never saw her. I gather there is some story line here that Im missing. Where exactly am I supposed to meet up with her?

[Sir BillyBob]

Why in the world did you meet Kourison??? I thought he only shows up if you have the scimatar that he wants. Did you cheat that sword in? If so, you caused the fight.

The girl (Megan) is between the tower and the guardhouse in Nashkel. You should have had to walk past her to move NW up through town to Jeremy. From what area did you come from to enter Nashkel? If you came directly from the dragon fight, you should have walked right into her. If you came down and entered the map at the NW corner near the bridge, you will have to walk down the road to her.

As for the dragon, it is a young dragon. It only has 70 or so HP, so a few good wacks should kill it. It may have the same problem that Ragast had mentioned about hurting themselves with the wind buffet.

I noticed that the lich will sometimes walk into his own skull traps (duh) and hurt himself. Same issue here I guess.

[mildImp]

I did not cheat the sword in. I am absolutely certain it was in the bag of holding that you retreive from the Lich's house along with several swords. I will check later. I came from the southern end of Nashkel straight from the Dragon fight. I did not run into her. I will check the area when I can and see what I can find.

[mildImp]

Found megan, she was a bit more to the east so I missed her as I was walking up towards the Nashkel Inn from the south. I dont think it would be hard to miss her given her position. She is just out of the parties LOS as they walk up Nashkel's main streat.

As for the sword that spawned Kourison, I know I got that from the bag of holding in the "dark one's" hut. Did you intend for that bag to be empty, because it has some unreal amount of magical weapons in it. As I remember it has several scimitars, a bastard sword, a couple of two handed swords, the Makalor katana (the one Kourison was after), some maces and clubs. It seemed an overly generous treasure, but I didnt mention anything. I assumed that these were the weapons of his betrayed party members. BTW, I tried to use NI to see what was in the bag of holding in the hut, but am not sure how to do that. I mean I can pull up the bag of holding item, but cannot figure out how to interogate its contents. Is this possible in NI?

[mildImp]

Here are the specifics of my install with respect to the contents (BAG20.STO) of the bag of holding (BAG20.ITM) at DSC003 in container 1 (which include Malakar, the sword Kourison was after):

Item: MISC3E.ITM (Black Spider Figurine),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,
Item: MISC3I.ITM (Silver Horn of Valhalla),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,
Item: SHLD26.ITM (Shield of the Lost +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,
Item: BOW18.ITM (Short Bow +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SW1H39.ITM (Blade of Searing +3),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SW1H06.ITM (Long Sword +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SW1H30.ITM (Belm +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SW1H45.ITM (Malakar +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SW2H07.ITM (Harbinger +3),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SPER08.ITM (Spear +3, Impaler),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: BLUN24.ITM (Club +2, Gnasher),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: XBOW09.ITM (Light Crossbow +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: BOW09.ITM (Ripper +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: AX1H12.ITM (Battle Axe +3, Stonefire),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,
Item: HALB04.ITM (Dragon's Bane +3),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: BLUN14.ITM (Flail of Ages +3),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: RING05.ITM (Ring of Invisibility ),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 1,
Item: CLCK02.ITM (Cloak of Protection +2),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,
Item: BLUN18.ITM (Skullcrusher +3),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,Quantity/Charges 2: 0,
Item: SLNG05.ITM (Sling +3 : 'Arla's Dragonbane'),Unknown: 00 00 h,Quantity/Charges 1: 0,


After looking at the Dsotsc install dir Im assuming the reference to BAG20.ITM in area DS003 is incorrect. Was it supposed to be DSBAG01.ITM?

Edited by mildImp, 07 November 2004 - 11:33 AM.

[Sir BillyBob]

Yes, it is pointing to the wrong bag. This should be fixed in 1.0 because I had the right back when testing that build (that was how I discovered the problem). There seems to be several bags in the game that contain great items. I just don't understand why they exist. You couldn't buy such a bag and they aren't the ones you find. So why are they in the SOA game? So for version 1.0, I build a new bag and store. So far from your logs, I gather that you are still testing the previous version. Otherwise, your area scripts would have worked.

[mildImp]

No, Im using the latest version, 1.0. Thats why I had those problems with the already visited areas and actors not showing up, I uninstalled the old version and reinstalled v1 without starting a new game. However, I never visited this area until well after i installed the latest version. I looked at the unrared Dsotsc/area dir for v1.0 and DSC003 still references BAG20.ITM. I got my copy of DSotSCv1CoreFiles.rar and DSotSCv1MainFiles.rar on 11/02, is it possible that you released new archives after that with the change?

Just to get my self back on track, should this have referenced DSBAG01.ITM?

Edited by mildImp, 07 November 2004 - 01:19 PM.

[hlidskialf]

Yes, it is pointing to the wrong bag.  This should be fixed in 1.0 because I had the right back when testing that build (that was how I discovered the problem).  There seems to be several bags in the game that contain great items.  I just don't understand why they exist.  You couldn't buy such a bag and they aren't the ones you find.  So why are they in the SOA game? 

They are random equipment "grab bags" for when you create a party in TOB. It's assumed that you'd have some of this uber-equipment if you'd played through SOA.

[Sir BillyBob]

No, Im using the latest version, 1.0. Thats why I had those problems with the already visited areas and actors not showing up, I uninstalled the old version and reinstalled v1 without starting a new game.  However, I never visited this area until well after i installed the latest version.  I looked at the unrared Dsotsc/area dir for v1.0 and  DSC003 still references BAG20.ITM.  I got my copy of DSotSCv1CoreFiles.rar and DSotSCv1MainFiles.rar on 11/02, is it possible that you released new archives after that with the change?

Just to get my self back on track, should this have referenced DSBAG01.ITM?

Yes, it should be the DSBAG01. Looks like another item to fix in the mod.

[mildImp]

BTW, does anyone know when you're really supposed to find the Malakar sword? I guess I need to get rid of the globals that spawn Kourison.