6 replies to this topic

[Torn]

Obviously, one of the major aspects of Baldur's Gate II, and in many ways the entire Dungeons and Dragons game, is the conflict between good and evil. However, I often find that in the hasty attempts to draw the battle lines between 'good' (typically noble paladins, unicorns and puppies) and 'evil' (typically goblins, liches and my cat), very little thought is put into what actually makes something 'good' or 'evil'.

So here is my question for the board:

How is it that you, personally, define good and evil?

Here's my take on it.

All people do what they do because they enjoy it, and think it's a worthwhile thing to pursue.
A 'good' person enjoys and considers worthwhile actions that make people happy. If you enjoy giving money to charity, helping old ladies across the street, etc, you would probably fall under 'good'.
An 'evil' person is, very simply, the opposite of this; they enjoy and consider worthwhile actions that make other people unhappy. Say you're walking down the street, and you see someone lying on the ground, bleeding to death after they were stabbed, so you kick them in their wound, throw dirt on them, hurl insults at their mothers and leave with a smile. That's evil... in my opinion, at least.

But like I said, this thread is for your opinions. What do you all think?

[Surtr]

There are many things that makes you evil, corrupted, or vile. Like... lying, cheating, theft, betrayal, murder, vengeance, worshipping evil gods and demons, animating the dead or creating undead, casting evil or corrupted spells, damning or harming souls, consorting with fiends, creating evil creatures, using others for personal gain, greed, bulling and cowing innocents, bringing despair, tempting others, cannibalism, masichism, self-mutilation, sadism, psychopathy, necrophylia, bringing suffering to everyone, spreading diseases in villiages or whole cities, slaughery, slavery, bestiality, alcoholism/drug addiction. Being an boorish thug, an tyrant, an scheming liar, an psychopath, an sophisticate, an misguided fool, an monster, being possessed by evil beings, the classic unexpected villian, or an dread emperor... hehe. Well, something like that.


There is also an interesting D&D source book out there that discovers the whole vileness of evil to its reader. The book is called "Book of Vile Darkness". Though its either for 3.0 or 3.5 edition, its still could have nice ideas for the Mod for the Wicked.

Edited by Surtr, 01 April 2005 - 03:48 AM.

[Hendryk]

The cases of purely selfish Evil are, I think, adequately represented in the game already. However, individuals in the Realms do enjoy an amenity which we lack. They have a multitude of, relatively speaking, immortal and purely aligned guides and exemplars upon the outer planes. So an individual who voluntarily and with self-abnegation subserves the Greater Evil for its own sake, rather than his/her/its own benefit, might make a challenge (and a strong dramatic contrast) even for an Evil PC of the selfish-to-the-point-of-megalomania sort.

[Deathsangel]

Well here are some words of the actual coder

There are so many reasons, or it can be just faith, what causes one to choose a certain path. In general there are the following things to consider (call them main paths)

Good - People can be good, because they feel that doing good things brings them satisfaction. Some people are good, because they do not know a different road. It is how they've been brought up. Others are good in order to redeem for the many evil acts they have commited a long time ago.

Neutral - people are neutral as they do not wish or can not choose. Some are even neutral as they see balance as the ultimate thing. Balance between all things would make certain there is a balanced word in which all things can live.

Evil - yes now it comes - Some are evil, because they believe it will lead to power as the only/quickest way or at least is the best way to accomplish their goals. They are selfish in their way of evil (Zartran NPC). Some are evil as (as hendryk said) they serve a greater power. This can be because they want the world reborn (see the movie: Constantine) or because they 'know' they can not achieve this greater evil and can serve only a small purpose hoping for a reward (as Fearun is now, it is mostly neutral/good, no changes needed according to many powers, so no problem) (Kido NPC). Some are evil because they no no other way or see it as the way to survive (Ariena NPC).

Sutr. I have the book of Vile Darkness. I also possess Exalted Deeds, all 'Complete' books, all three Monster Manuals (3.5 updated), Planar Handbook, Player's Handbook 3.0 & 3.5, DM Guide 3.0 & 3.5, Manual of the Planes, (Expanded) Psionic Handbook, tome of Blood, Song and Silence & Swords and Fists. That is it I believe... and the reason why I am 'just' a student

Aristothenes, if you mean, if you kill someone to end their uncurable suffering. It is seen mostly as a good act. However, only if you surely know the person will die without your intervention. To kill someone and say: 'he was poisoned anyway', isn't good enough. Even more so if the poison wasn't deadly. That is bending the conditions to your whim and that is considered evil.

Hope I more or less said what I meant

Edited by Deathsangel, 04 April 2005 - 12:01 AM.

[Cat87]

I for one think the alingment descriptions do a pretty good job of defining good and evil.

Personally, I have trouble articulating what I want to say. I know what is good and evil, if you were to show me an action (or explain it to me in context) I could tell you if it is good or evil, but I can't explain what good and evil in their purest forms are.

[Deathsangel]

Efreet's post moved to proper topic. That is: FAQ about the mod in general

Edited by Deathsangel, 21 May 2005 - 06:37 AM.