159 replies to this topic

[PolarBear]

Nah, it was just a random thought

[Stone Wolf]

It could. It would require scripting to check for the current dex of the target and swapping out different versions of the armor with different penalties.

[T.G.Maestro]

It would require scripting to check for the current dex of the target

I'm not overly sure about this - ability scores are modified by way too many things to act as a precise basis for scripts. I guess the_bigg can say more to this though.

[the bigg]

It would require scripting to check for the current dex of the target

I'm not overly sure about this - ability scores are modified by way too many things to act as a precise basis for scripts. I guess the_bigg can say more to this though.

No. We add enough **** to the baldur.bcs right now.

Regarding the Use Armor HLA, I believe it to be too much code-heavy to be really worth it, however if you protest enough I might bow and do it.

[Stone Wolf]

Note that I didn't say it was a good idea. Enough script blocks like that slows the game down, so it's rarely worth doing.

[T.G.Maestro]

Agreed.

[Jinnai]

I'm thinking most of your lastest shield ideas are okay except i'd add -1 dexterity to medium shield. There is no reason for a moevement penalty, but there is also no reason for it to just be better than a small shield with no drawbacks.

Also the buckler was not used for blocking excpet for missiles and in duels. Because unlike even a small shield it is quite small and so close to the wrist it would do little do stop an attack from a weapon. Instead it should give the +1 vs missiles and a 2% DR (yea 2% isn't noteworthy, but its not worthy of even 5%). This is because any weapon hitting it would easily penatrate it if effort were put in it, which is usually is. As I said, this was an armor to protect the wrist mostly from disabling (which you aren't going to be implimenting) and missile fire while in melee combat where larger shields would hamper your combat style.

I'm not really for thieveing or casting failures, but i think slowing down the skills and spells for medium and large sheilds by 1 is balancing and not far fetched condisering its otherwise just benifiting multis even more.

You may also wish to redo min strs for heavier armors which would go a long way to the argument mentioned earlier about weak but dexterious people still benifiting from heavier armors. Carrying it around with you in a sack is not the same as wearing it. Also you could add constitution RQs for the full-body armors since those tend to sap people with low health and stamina faster.

[T.G.Maestro]

@ a savage: your topic has been merged into this one to avoid unnecessary confusion.

Hi
I was wondering how the cleric spells
blade barrier and globe of blades would behave within those changes.
I think their damage is magical and resistable to magical resistance.
It would be nice if you could translate it to slashing or a mix of piercing slashing dmg.

These changes are absolutely possible, but only in a future component. We've been toying with the idea of "Spell Revisions", but I fear it will have to wait.
But to answer your question, yes, it is possible, and it is a good idea.

I dont know if you have to give the spells then some sort of enchantment lvl since liches and their demi form have enchantment lvl restrictions to hit. So they wont be killed outright somehow.

While MR wouldn't affect the spell anymore, we could add a simple save to avoid half/full damage. The options are there at least.

On another note there might be ways to get a ridiculous high dmg reduction from weapons involving faith armor, the defender flail, restored bhaal gifts(?) and the studded armor from the chosen of cyric component. This might be something to have a look into, I didnt do the maths here but i guess a value of 80 is reachable.

Already noted, this is indeed a serious problem, one that still needs to be deal with. :closedeyes:

I'm thinking most of your lastest shield ideas are okay except i'd add -1 dexterity to medium shield. There is no reason for a moevement penalty, but there is also no reason for it to just be better than a small shield with no drawbacks.

True, but in the GAME (anmd not RL), there is a reason - mostly because the game counts the Medium Shield a better shield than a Small one.

Also the buckler was not used for blocking excpet for missiles and in duels. Because unlike even a small shield it is quite small and so close to the wrist it would do little do stop an attack from a weapon

I can't agree with you entirely - in my opinion, a buckler is very incapable to vlock incoming missiles, mainly because it's size. OTOH, it is capable to deflect (not directly block) melee attacks when positioned the right way.

I'm not really for thieveing or casting failures, but i think slowing down the skills and spells for medium and large sheilds by 1 is balancing and not far fetched condisering its otherwise just benifiting multis even more

Yes, I also condiered adding a +1 to spellcasting speed while using Medium or Tower Shields... we'll see.

[Jinnai]

The type of weapons a buckler could safely block were limited to missile weapons and slashing weapons that would give any bonus. Bludegoning weapons would easily break a wrist of one who foolishing decided to block one and piercing weapons, well even small shields can't handly them well.

[T.G.Maestro]

The type of weapons a buckler could safely block were limited to missile weapons and slashing weapons that would give any bonus. Bludegoning weapons would easily break a wrist of one who foolishing decided to block one and piercing weapons, well even small shields can't handly them well.

As I said, I'm referring to deflecting blows instead of blocking them .
Also, while in RL everything you said would sound much more blieveable, in this game we also have to take care for item balance and their original concept.

[Jinnai]

Well as far as the original concept goes, those two things i listed were what was meant in PnP if you can use weapon types, which we can.

However i'd give you that enchanted buckers might be able to block bludgeoning weapons, but not the normal one. None of them should give any bonuses to piercing weapons though. This part is specfically mentioned in several areas in both 2nd and 3rd.

[Jinnai]

If i'm well trained at using daggers I can block the same way every weapon, but you know we're not going to be giving weapons for being so skilled at daggers, even though its appropriate. Why? Because the level of expertise required would be extrodinatly high. The same is true for a buckler as well.

You'd really haveto specialize if fighting style with bucklers only to be able to block any kind of melee attack like that without any risk of injury and do it quite well.

Edited by Jinnai, 14 July 2005 - 07:59 PM.

[Littiz]

It would be nice if you could translate it to slashing or a mix of piercing slashing dmg. I dont know if you have to give the spells then some sort of enchantment lvl since liches and their demi form have enchantment lvl restrictions to hit. So they wont be killed outright somehow.

Hm, if the spell creates "magical blades" or something, it's fitting to stick with magical damage, imho.
On the other hand, I seem to recall that Blade Barrier bypasses MR by default (still a save is to be rolled): if I'm right here, we might imagine those blades as already "real" for our purposes.
Actually, it would be a nice little refinement

[Jinnai]

Bucklers were used in tandem with broadswords in fencing.  Broadswords are pretty heavy and I'm pretty sure noblemen weren't wearing the bucklers because they looked cool.   A buckler is a lot sturdier than than you give it credit to be.

I did not make them out to be flimsy, but they have limits.

You did not see noblemen trying to block claymores with those bucklers, or warhammers or even a two-handed war axe for the most part. For all the wieght of a broadsword, and i've wielded one, and not one of those cheap lighter versions made today, its nothing to a warhammer, a large full iron mace or claymore.