108 replies to this topic

[OneEyedPhoenix]

Miloch, on Sep 18 2009, 01:06 PM, said:

[This is pretty much done and tested, just working on a related component. So far it has the following:

I just don't understand the 1st option. What does it mean "remove duplicate tresure"? And also how the % works? I mean ... if a Xvart has a little gem, how is it handle to be reduced to 25% for example?

Tx,

mm75

It's for creatures with more than one rndtre.itm

[Miloch]

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 18 2009, 03:47 PM, said:

melkor_morgoth75, on Sep 18 2009, 02:37 PM, said:

I just don't understand the 1st option. What does it mean "remove duplicate tresure"?

It's for creatures with more than one rndtre.itm

Right. If it's not a dragon or lich and has more than one rndtre.itm, it's left with only the last one in its inventory (usually the best too, but not always).

melkor_morgoth75, on Sep 18 2009, 02:37 PM, said:

And also how the % works? I mean ... if a Xvart has a little gem, how is it handle to be reduced to 25% for example?

If you pick the 25% loss component, only 3 out of 4 CREs who had random treasure will now have them. If you pick the 75% option, only 1 in 4 will have them. So either it'll have it or not, it doesn't reduce the amount of treasure if it does have it.

[OneEyedPhoenix]

So... How much bug-testing needs to be done before we get close to something releasable?

[Miloch]

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 18 2009, 10:58 PM, said:

So... How much bug-testing needs to be done before we get close to something releasable?

It's pretty much tested and debugged. Was just going to run it on my BWP install (gulp). I guess I could float you a pre-release if you want to test it too. But I was going to package it with the next Aurora release, which is also pretty much done - just one new component we're trying to iron out.

Why Aurora? Because I'm trying to reduce the number of mini-mods I have floating around, and it also already contains an updated Store Prices mini-mod, including the following components GeN1e and I reworked:

• Change store buying prices
  
• Change store selling prices
  
• Change gem and jewelry prices
  
• Change creature gold carried

So basically, with the addition of this component and the other one, you can rework the Faerunian economy however you like .

The other component is a "Reduce quest gold rewards" which is also essentially done, at least as far as modding the actual amounts granted. We're just trying to change the dialogue references too, otherwise it may seem odd if you're offered 10,000 and only get 5,000 or whatever. But we have some wei-fu ninjery up our sleeves, if someone can convince GeN1e to get it working instead of giving up and going back to playing NWN2 .

[OneEyedPhoenix]

Does your mod take care of scrl2i.itm as well Miloch? (It's the "Why does a chair have arms and legs...." scroll)
I have been getting quite a few of these as random loot.

[Miloch]

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 21 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Does your mod take care of scrl2i.itm as well Miloch? (It's the "Why does a chair have arms and legs...." scroll) I have been getting quite a few of these as random loot.

Do you know which creatures you're getting these from? It appears to be a BGT bug, since it appends 3 lines from the BG1 random scroll table to the random weapon table, for some reason not clear.

The BGT developer's documentation says this:

Quote

The major compatibility issue with Check the Bodies is the random treasure tables. To solve this problem, Baldur’s Gate Trilogy-WeiDU patches the random treasure tables differently if Check the Bodies is installed before it. Check the Bodies v1.6 fills RNDTREAS.2DA with the maximum number of rows allowed by the engine and does not change all other RND*.2DA files. Newer versions of Check the Bodies use a dynamic system to fill random treasure tables from the lowest priority RND*.2DA upwards. To cater for both scenarios, Baldur’s Gate Trilogy-WeiDU patches random treasure tables by avoiding RNDTREAS.2DA entirely and works around the end result of ‘lowest priority’ patching. The particulars are shown below:

RNDWEP.2DA: appended with the first three lines of the original RNDSCROL.2DA

RNDMAGIC.2DA: appended with the fourth line of the original RNDSCROL.2DA, the first two lines of the original RNDMAGIC.2DA, and the first line of the original RNDTREAS.2DA

RNDEQUIP.2DA: appended with the last line of the original RNDMAGIC.2DA and the last four lines of the original RNDTREAS.2DA
Creatures are dynamically patched to account for changes in the location of random treasure rows.

But I still don't get why it's putting scrolls in a weapon table, and ones from BG1 for that matter, since these lines were fixed in BG2.

Anyway, I can patch it out I guess. I'm tempted to wipe these last 3 lines entirely from rndwep.2da, since they're all scrolls and have no real place in a random weapons table.

[OneEyedPhoenix]

Miloch, on Sep 21 2009, 10:42 PM, said:

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 21 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Does your mod take care of scrl2i.itm as well Miloch? (It's the "Why does a chair have arms and legs...." scroll) I have been getting quite a few of these as random loot.

Do you know which creatures you're getting these from? It appears to be a BGT bug, since it appends 3 lines from the BG1 random scroll table to the random weapon table, for some reason not clear.

Last time it was from an ankheg, summoned by bgspawn, so if melkor used the vanilla ankheg01.cre the problem is a rndtre04. (ankheg.cre has a rndequ07.itm) So no rndwep...

[Miloch]

It's rndequ07 which in turn references rndwep08, since BGT apparently patched all the BG1 CREs that had rndtre to use rndequ instead. So I'll have to include those in the anti-scroll patch, and probably replace that entry from the table for those who should have scrolls.

[melkor_morgoth75]

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 21 2009, 11:14 PM, said:

Last time it was from an ankheg, summoned by bgspawn, so if melkor used the vanilla ankheg01.cre the problem is a rndtre04. (ankheg.cre has a rndequ07.itm) So no rndwep...

Just to let u know that I used ankheg.cre (from BG1),

mm75

[Ascension64]

I just reviewed this, and the part of the DevDoc that you quoted is only effected if people installed CtB before BGT.

In vanilla BGT, all treasure tables are in their correct spots as for BG1, except for one RNDTREAS line (POOR). POOR doesn't fit into RNDTREAS since the maximum number of rows is 9. Hence it was moved to RNDWEP. What I can do to correct for the distribution of this single line, then, is to put it into RNDMAGIC instead. That would make everything equivalent.

[OneEyedPhoenix]

You might want to do something about this guy as well miloch...
Kobold Scribe (kobscr01.cre).
He is a vanilla bg2 creature with 3 each of rndscr01, rndscr02 and rndscr03.
As I understand your mod it only deals with rndtre, so this guy would fall outside of the mod.

[Miloch]

Ascension64, on Sep 23 2009, 07:53 AM, said:

In vanilla BGT, all treasure tables are in their correct spots as for BG1, except for one RNDTREAS line (POOR). POOR doesn't fit into RNDTREAS since the maximum number of rows is 9. Hence it was moved to RNDWEP. What I can do to correct for the distribution of this single line, then, is to put it into RNDMAGIC instead. That would make everything equivalent.

Eh... on my BWP install, POOR_BG1 *is* the 6th row of rndmagic.2da. There's nothing at all like it in rndwep.2da. Also like I said, rndmagic.2da is pushed beyond the max at 13 rows on a BWP install (BGT, CtB and Exnem or something adding all those rows, not sure). Whereas rndwep.2da is at 9 rows. So you're not going to be able to add anything to either table. In theory, you could swap entries but I'm not sure that's feasible.

I should also point out that particularly the "POOR" entries in BG1 and BG2's rndtreas.2da are practically identical. The only real difference is BG2 hardcodes a scrl75 (Identify) whereas BG1 has rndscr01. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, neither is really appropriate since the average reward in this row is 1-2 GP and a scroll is at least 100 GP. So I've patched it out of both rows, but my point is having both rows is a bit redundant, so if you were going to bother with moving one, you might as well delete one to free up space a bit (or use a hybrid approach). I don't know how that'd affect mods that rely on certain entries though, and you can't really patch mods that are installed after BGT.

It's the other 4 rows that are the problem, since they were moved from the weighted rndtreas.2da to the unweighted rndequip.2da. But also like I said, this mod should resolve that at least for non-scroll users.

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 23 2009, 08:22 PM, said:

You might want to do something about this guy as well miloch...
Kobold Scribe (kobscr01.cre).
He is a vanilla bg2 creature with 3 each of rndscr01, rndscr02 and rndscr03.
As I understand your mod it only deals with rndtre, so this guy would fall outside of the mod.

It deals with any sort of rnd*.itm, so this guy is already addressed. Not sure if he's actually used in an area you can get to, but he gets patched anyway.

[OneEyedPhoenix]

Miloch, on Sep 24 2009, 08:00 AM, said:

It deals with any sort of rnd*.itm, so this guy is already addressed. Not sure if he's actually used in an area you can get to, but he gets patched anyway.

Ok, just checking. I encountered this guy as a part of a larger pack of kobolds in Gullykin and found the whole concept a bit ridiculous. I mean a kobold Scribe, of all things, with 9 wis and int, carrying 9 scrolls from level 8 and down... He is the most silly creature I have encountered so far.

Edited by OneEyedPhoenix, 24 September 2009 - 02:15 AM.

[melkor_morgoth75]

OneEyedPhoenix, on Sep 24 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

Ok, just checking. I encountered this guy as a part of a larger pack of kobolds in Gullykin and found the whole concept a bit ridiculous. I mean a kobold Scribe, of all things, with 9 wis and int, carrying 9 scrolls from level 8 and down... He is the most silly creature I have encountered so far.

It comes from my mod anyway ... and it is a bg2 creature.
Do u think kobolds cannot study/read? It could make sense, in the game anyway there are A LOT of different kobolds, i'm honest to say i don't know right now in AD&D if they really exist. Any clue?

mm75

[GeN1e]

Deekin

[Ascension64]

Miloch, on Sep 24 2009, 04:00 PM, said:

Ascension64, on Sep 23 2009, 07:53 AM, said:

In vanilla BGT, all treasure tables are in their correct spots as for BG1, except for one RNDTREAS line (POOR). POOR doesn't fit into RNDTREAS since the maximum number of rows is 9. Hence it was moved to RNDWEP. What I can do to correct for the distribution of this single line, then, is to put it into RNDMAGIC instead. That would make everything equivalent.

Eh... on my BWP install, POOR_BG1 *is* the 6th row of rndmagic.2da. There's nothing at all like it in rndwep.2da. Also like I said, rndmagic.2da is pushed beyond the max at 13 rows on a BWP install (BGT, CtB and Exnem or something adding all those rows, not sure). Whereas rndwep.2da is at 9 rows. So you're not going to be able to add anything to either table. In theory, you could swap entries but I'm not sure that's feasible.

Ah, we are talking about different things here. Vanilla BGT gets it right, CtB+BGT gets it wrong, but BGT+CtB gets it right. If you wish to petition for a radical change in the way that the CtB treasure system operates so that it gets out of the way of BGT, not the other way round, then I might think about a change to the CtB+BGT bit.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Ascension64, on Sep 25 2009, 11:56 AM, said:

Miloch, on Sep 24 2009, 04:00 PM, said:

Eh... on my BWP install

Ah, we are talking about different things here. Vanilla BGT gets it right, CtB+BGT gets it wrong, but BGT+CtB gets it right. If you wish to petition for a radical change in the way that the CtB treasure system operates so that it gets out of the way of BGT, not the other way round, then I might think about a change to the CtB+BGT bit.

BWP install-

BiG_World_v8.0_english.pdf said:

4. THE BIG BG2 MODS
4.1. The Darkest Day v.1.12
4.2. Shadows Over Soubar v.1.13
4.3. Check the Bodies v1.11
Check the Bodies Fast Forward, v1.1 (for CtB v1.8 or later)
4.4. Tortured Souls TS-BP v6.10
4.5. Region of Terror 2.1

5. BGT TRILOGY
5.1. Baldur?s Gate Trilogy ? WeiDU BGT-WeiDU v1.07
5.1a. BGTMusic with Songlist Patch
5.2. only for German users
5.3. Restored Prologue Textscreen Music for BG1TuTu and BGT-WeiDU v7
5.4. Baldur?s Gate Trilogy-Never Ending Journey 2 Compatibility Modification v1
5.5. BGTNeJ2 v1.1

[Miloch]

melkor_morgoth75, on Sep 24 2009, 09:10 PM, said:

Do u think kobolds cannot study/read?

They'd probably have about the same literacy rate as humans in the medieval period, meaning that most couldn't/didn't read or write, but a few exceptional ones could. Believe it or not, kobolds are of "average" (8-10) intelligence, in other words, not really different from humans. And the maximum INT for a kobold is 17 according to the 2e Book of Humanoids, so they can be clerics and shamans.

GeN1e, on Sep 24 2009, 11:39 PM, said:

Deekin

Well this is 2nd edition, before WtC/WtF/3e/NWN2 Disneyfied them, making them dragonkin bardic scribes or whatever (some discussion on that here).

But anywayyy... this guy is called a "Scribe" after all, so obviously he can write. His INT gets boosted and he's left with 1 scroll if you choose any of the duplicate-nerfing components (which would be most of them).

Ascension64, on Sep 25 2009, 08:56 AM, said:

Ah, we are talking about different things here. Vanilla BGT gets it right, CtB+BGT gets it wrong, but BGT+CtB gets it right. If you wish to petition for a radical change in the way that the CtB treasure system operates so that it gets out of the way of BGT, not the other way round, then I might think about a change to the CtB+BGT bit.

What exactly is "right" and "wrong"? You were talking about moving POOR_BG1 to rndmagic.2da, but it's already there on my CtB+BGT install, so wouldn't that be "more right?" And as Jarno points out, that's the recommended install order per the BWP.

Can someone post their rnd*.2da files from a BGT without CtB (and BGT+CtB* if that's any different)? Just export them with NearInfinity or DLTCEP (or grab them from you're override, if they're not biffed). I guess I have to account for every possible variance here, and I'm not really in a position to install more copies of BGT on my maxed-out hard drive. It's not really clear from the DevDoc what's where.

Edit: By BGT+CtB, I mean with Check the Bodies installed *after* BGT, though I'm not sure anyone installs it that way anymore with the advent of BWP.

Edited by Miloch, 25 September 2009 - 03:41 AM.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Miloch, on Sep 25 2009, 02:39 PM, said:

Can someone post their rnd*.2da files from a BGT without CtB ?

WeiDU.log said:

// Log of Currently Installed WeiDU Mods
// The top of the file is the 'oldest' mod
// ~TP2_File~ #language_number #component_number // [Subcomponent Name -> ] Component Name [ : Version]
~SETUP-BGT.TP2~ #0 #0 // Baldur's Gate Trilogy - Core: 1.07
~CHANTERKIT/SETUP-CHANTERKIT.TP2~ #0 #0 // Chanter Kit
~IMPILATION/SETUP-IMPILATION.TP2~ #0 #0 // The Cerberus mod for BG2:SoA, version 1: v1 alpha 5
~IMPILATION/SETUP-IMPILATION.TP2~ #0 #1 // The Imps Cave adventure for BG2:SoA, version 0.9alpha 2: v1 alpha 5
~IMPILATION/SETUP-IMPILATION.TP2~ #0 #2 // Magical Resistance Redo v0.3beta: v1 alpha 5
~IMPILATION/SETUP-IMPILATION.TP2~ #0 #3 // The Imps Item additions, for BGT and Tutu: v1 alpha 5

IMPILATION do not make any different to those files.

Attached Files

•  BGTv1.07_rnd.zip   2.11K   44 downloads

[Ascension64]

Quote

What exactly is "right" and "wrong"? You were talking about moving POOR_BG1 to rndmagic.2da, but it's already there on my CtB+BGT install, so wouldn't that be "more right?" And as Jarno points out, that's the recommended install order per the BWP.

No, I am talking about moving POOR_BG1 to RNDMAGIC.2DA in a vanilla BGT install. to get it right would be to try and imitate BG1 behaviour in relation to getting the distribution the same (2D10 vs. 1D20).