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Stutter in Baldur's Gate (BWP 8)


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#1 --Anonymous--

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 10:53 AM

I'm running a BWP 8.0 Tactics install.

Things have run pretty smoothly thus far. The game freezes/crashes periodically, possibly due to the Widescreen mod or a script hanging, so I save often. Beyond that, minimal problems.

Now that I've entered the city of Baldur's Gate, though, the game is rapidly becoming unplayable. The game stutters. Everything pauses a little more than once per second. It started in the first (East) district. After traveling to the NE district it's far worse. The last time I had this trouble was in a previous install. Back then I learned to avoid containers like the plague (and I still do) since the scripting engine gets bogged down trying to iterate through dozens/hundreds of items.

I've tried solving the problem by killing off all the useless peasants/commoners with CTRL+Y then resting 8 hours so they disappear. I figured it'd reduce the number of script blocks running each tick. That didn't help.

So... Help? Please?

WeiDU log:
Spoiler


#2 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 11:19 AM

Done all these? Answer 4.

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#3 --Anonymous--

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 12:18 PM

Done all these? Answer 4.


I've done pretty much everything on that list (the ones that apply anyway -- I already avoid bags of holding and such). I don't entirely understand that TP2 stuff, but looking at the linked thread it appears to refer to the "someone keeps trying to perform some scripted action and ends up looking epileptic" stutter. I really wish we had distinct words to differentiate the two (or more?) different types of stuttering behavior. :P

I have not defragmented my drive, though I can try that tonight.

I did notice something interesting while testing a few things. I killed off my party with CTRL+Y then removed them from the party. The massive party deaths gave CHARNAME a brief morale failure (don't think that's supposed to happen to the PC...), during which the stutter appeared to stop. When he stopped being a pansy next round, the stutter returned. So either it was a fluke or morale failure halts CRE scripts and it's one of the scripts on the PC that's causing trouble. I'm not entirely sure if the problem stopped. It only lasted a round or so. Still, potential progress...

If that doesn't lead me anywhere, here's another question: Does it matter that I've visited some 100 (estimate) areas during the game thus far? In other words, do area scripts (or CRE scripts in the area) continue running when you leave the area? If so, is there any good way to purge an area from the save file that I can use on all the nigh-empty houses I've ransacked?

#4 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 12:46 PM

The massive party deaths gave CHARNAME a brief morale failure (don't think that's supposed to happen to the PC...), during which the stutter appeared to stop.

Could you attach you save? I would look at the Main chars .cre file... ah, you have to be a member I think, time to join up, or attach it to a site like this or that, and give us a link.

If that doesn't lead me anywhere, here's another question: Does it matter that I've visited some 100 (estimate) areas during the game thus far? In other words, do area scripts (or CRE scripts in the area) continue running when you leave the area? If so, is there any good way to purge an area from the save file that I can use on all the nigh-empty houses I've ransacked?

If you don't use the CLUAConsole to move between areas, you'll be only running one area script.

Could you also --change-log the 'player1.bcs' 'player2.bcs' 'player3.bcs' files if it exists.

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#5 Darpaek

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 03:40 PM

The "script stutter" you refer (the stutter you don't have) to is pretty obvious, and easily fixed with a stutter test.

The stutter you have, I call the "Aerie/Nalia Stutter" because I could solve it by Ctrl-Ying Aerie or Nalia (but it returned upon Rez).

Have you tried #20 on the stutter list? It personally worked for me, plus another has reported recently that it worked for them. You should try it. Even if it doesn't work, it's quick and easy just to try. The guy who discovered it is really a genius.

#6 --Anonymous--

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 04:00 PM

The "script stutter" you refer (the stutter you don't have) to is pretty obvious, and easily fixed with a stutter test.

The stutter you have, I call the "Aerie/Nalia Stutter" because I could solve it by Ctrl-Ying Aerie or Nalia (but it returned upon Rez).

Have you tried #20 on the stutter list? It personally worked for me, plus another has reported recently that it worked for them. You should try it. Even if it doesn't work, it's quick and easy just to try. The guy who discovered it is really a genius.


I don't really understand #20. I tried what I thought it said. I imported the save into ToB, then loaded the save. It didn't seem to help at all. I'm probably misunderstanding it, since I don't understand why importing the save would change future loads. Surely the import doesn't alter the saved game itself. If you could explain it more clearly, that might help.

#7 EarthquakeDamage

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 04:23 PM

Huh. Seems I already registered several years ago and forgot about it. I'll have to remember that. :P

Anyway, more information:

1. It's probably not the CRE for CHARNAME that's a problem. I removed absolutely all effects from the party (except local vars) with SK and removed all states (like invisibility, aid, non-targetable, &c). I also removed all inventory items except equipped weapons, none of which I expect have any scripting (they were mostly things like a +3 dwarven thrower) since the quick weapon slots can get wonky or cause crashes since SK doesn't update them when you change those item slots. Anyway, none of that helped.

2. I tried CTRL+Y-ing the party again. No morale failure (must've been a fluke), btw. It seemed to help, though there was still some stutter. When I removed them from the party, however, the stutter was horrible again. Resting 8 hours didn't help. Not sure what's up with that if the party NPCs are the problem. The game clean up non-quest items and corpses from the ground when you rest. I always assumed the dead CREs were deleted entirely when it did that. Maybe not?

Grr... Botched this "Quick Edit" thing. Trying again.

I tried getting a change-log on those scripts but I'm lacking a file. "Mur'Neth/backup/0/MAPPINGS.0" to be precise. Should I just make an empty file with that name or does it need some particular format/content?

Edited by EarthquakeDamage, 20 September 2009 - 04:30 PM.


#8 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 08:50 PM

The guy who discovered it is really a genius.

Yeah, you are.

If you could explain it more clearly, that might help.

Well, it won't help you... as you did everything you needed.

I tried getting a change-log on those scripts but I'm lacking a file. "Mur'Neth/backup/0/MAPPINGS.0" to be precise. Should I just make an empty file with that name or does it need some particular format/content?

That's because you used the Cleanup.bat, that's bad for debugging...

Now, the saves, thanks.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 20 September 2009 - 08:53 PM.

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#9 OneEyedPhoenix

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 01:27 AM

I tried getting a change-log on those scripts but I'm lacking a file. "Mur'Neth/backup/0/MAPPINGS.0" to be precise. Should I just make an empty file with that name or does it need some particular format/content?

That's because you used the Cleanup.bat, that's bad for debugging...


All is not lost for the Change log. You just have to do what I did here: link

A bit time consuming, but invaluable for debugging.

#10 EarthquakeDamage

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 08:41 AM

Here's my debugging save. Everyone's stripped of effects and items atm, but the stutter isn't any better as far as I can tell. I do think the party NPCs, especially Indira, are part of the problem. CTRL+Y them one by one. Killing Indira drops the stutter to a manageable level, though her script (J#INDI.bcs) seems to consist of a single block that shouldn't be causing problems (despite having had Finch in the party once upon a time). Removing Edwin & Imoen from the party adds some stutter. Removing dead Indira returns the stutter to their original nigh-unplayable levels.

I'll try what OneEyedPhoenix suggests and get some almost-but-not-quite change-logs for you.

Attached Files


Edited by EarthquakeDamage, 21 September 2009 - 08:42 AM.


#11 OneEyedPhoenix

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 10:24 AM

I'll try what OneEyedPhoenix suggests and get some almost-but-not-quite change-logs for you.


I can see that you have AzenMOD and NSC Portraits installed like me. If your game behaves anything like mine then those mods will give you trouble when you try to make a change log. if they do then just download these two files and unpack them into their respective mod folders. (will save you some time I think). These files are blanks, so you will get no false information from them (no information at all in fact).

Attached Files



#12 EarthquakeDamage

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 10:49 AM

...

Apparently trying multiple files at once screws things up. Here are the change logs for...

dplayer1.bcs
[weidu] WeiDU version 21100
[./CHITIN.KEY] 494 BIFFs, 97504 resources
[./dialog.tlk] 331757 string entries
[weidu] Using scripting style "BG2"
[1PP.TP2] parsed
[1PP_AVATARS/SETUP-1PP_AVATARS.TP2] parsed
[1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES/SETUP-1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES.TP2] parsed
[1PP_THIEVES_GALORE/SETUP-1PP_THIEVES_GALORE.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-NSCPORTRAITS.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-BP-BGT-WORLDMAP.TP2] parsed
[LEVEL1NPCS/LEVEL1NPCS.TP2] parsed
[W_GUI/SETUP-W_GUI.TP2] parsed
[GENERALIZED_BIFFING/GENERALIZED_BIFFING.TP2] parsed



Mods affecting DPLAYER1.BCS:

dplayer2.bcs
[weidu] WeiDU version 21100
[./CHITIN.KEY] 494 BIFFs, 97504 resources
[./dialog.tlk] 331757 string entries
[weidu] Using scripting style "BG2"
[TDD/Language/English/setup.tra] has 217 translation strings
[TDD/Language/English/tp2.tra] has 1773 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/prompts.tra] has 45 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/setup.tra] has 71 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/dialog.tra] has 31 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/journal.tra] has 319 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/scripts.tra] has 22 translation strings
[gavin/tra/english/setup.tra] has 76 translation strings
[Tsujatha/English/Setup-Tsujatha.tra] has 80 translation strings
[edwin/tra/english/setup.tra] has 35 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\arcane.tra] has 416 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\divine.tra] has 293 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\setup.tra] has 3 translation strings
[scs/tra/english/english.tra] has 516 translation strings
[scsII/tra/english/english.tra] has 466 translation strings
[BGTTweak/Language/English/prompts.tra] has 91 translation strings
[BGTTweak/Language/English/setup.tra] has 42 translation strings
[aTweaks/TRA/ENGLISH/aTweaks.tra] has 63 translation strings
[NMR-V1.5/English/NMR-setup.tra] has 104 translation strings
[1PP.TP2] parsed
[1PP_AVATARS/SETUP-1PP_AVATARS.TP2] parsed
[1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES/SETUP-1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES.TP2] parsed
[1PP_THIEVES_GALORE/SETUP-1PP_THIEVES_GALORE.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-NSCPORTRAITS.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-BP-BGT-WORLDMAP.TP2] parsed
[LEVEL1NPCS/LEVEL1NPCS.TP2] parsed
[W_GUI/SETUP-W_GUI.TP2] parsed
[GENERALIZED_BIFFING/GENERALIZED_BIFFING.TP2] parsed



Mods affecting DPLAYER2.BCS:
00000: /* from game biffs */ ~SETUP-TDD.TP2~ 0 0 // The Darkest Day,  v1.12
00001: /* from game biffs */ ~SETUP-BGT.TP2~ 0 0 // Baldur's Gate Trilogy - Core
00002: ~GAVIN/GAVIN.TP2~ 0 0 // Gavin NPC for Tutu and BGT, 14April2008
00003: ~SETUP-TSUJATHA.TP2~ 0 0 // Tsujatha (BG2:SoA NPC) created by Sillara of the Tamari
00004: ~SETUP-EDWINROMANCE.TP2~ 0 0 // EdwinRomance
00005: ~SPELL_REV/SETUP-SPELL_REV.TP2~ 0 0 // Spell Revisions
00006: ~SETUP-SCS.TP2~ 0 5000 // Smarter general AI
00007: ~SCSII/SETUP-SCSII.TP2~ 0 6021 // About half of all unused potions on dead enemies are retrievable by the party (the rest are assumed to break)
00008: ~SETUP-BGTTWEAK.TP2~ 0 1502 // Make armor and shields shatter
00009: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 100 // Restore innate infravision to Half-Orc characters
00010: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 130 // Additional racial traits for Dwarves
00011: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 140 // Additional racial traits for Gnomes
00012: ~SETUP-NMR-V1.5.TP2~ 2 4 // NM-Relationship:Relationship system to the expansion of the original BG2 script.1

dplayer3.bcs
[weidu] WeiDU version 21100
[./CHITIN.KEY] 494 BIFFs, 97504 resources
[./dialog.tlk] 331757 string entries
[weidu] Using scripting style "BG2"
[RoTerror/Language/English/scripts.tra] has 533 translation strings
[RoTerror/Language/English/journal.tra] has 165 translation strings
[RoTerror/Language/English/setup.tra] has 1725 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/prompts.tra] has 45 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/setup.tra] has 71 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/dialog.tra] has 31 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/journal.tra] has 319 translation strings
[BGT/Language/English/scripts.tra] has 22 translation strings
[emad\English\setup.tra] has 48 translation strings
[amber/tra/english/setup.tra] has 233 translation strings
[Chloe\D\English\setup.tra] has 90 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\arcane.tra] has 416 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\divine.tra] has 293 translation strings
[spell_rev\Languages\english\setup.tra] has 3 translation strings
[BGTTweak/Language/English/prompts.tra] has 91 translation strings
[BGTTweak/Language/English/setup.tra] has 42 translation strings
[aTweaks/TRA/ENGLISH/aTweaks.tra] has 63 translation strings
[NMR-V1.5/English/NMR-setup.tra] has 104 translation strings
[xpmod/english/Setup.tra] has 24 translation strings
[1PP.TP2] parsed
[1PP_AVATARS/SETUP-1PP_AVATARS.TP2] parsed
[1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES/SETUP-1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES.TP2] parsed
[1PP_THIEVES_GALORE/SETUP-1PP_THIEVES_GALORE.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-NSCPORTRAITS.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-BP-BGT-WORLDMAP.TP2] parsed
[LEVEL1NPCS/LEVEL1NPCS.TP2] parsed
[W_GUI/SETUP-W_GUI.TP2] parsed
[GENERALIZED_BIFFING/GENERALIZED_BIFFING.TP2] parsed



Mods affecting DPLAYER3.BCS:
00000: /* from game biffs */ ~SETUP-ROT.TP2~ 0 0 // Region Of Terror, v2.1
00001: /* from game biffs */ ~SETUP-BGT.TP2~ 0 0 // Baldur's Gate Trilogy - Core
00002: ~EMAD/SETUP-EMAD.TP2~ 0 0 // A Z-rated Adventure - an IM4 Non-Entry
00003: ~EMAD/SETUP-EMAD.TP2~ 0 2 // A Bhaalspawn's Best Friend
00004: ~EMAD/SETUP-EMAD.TP2~ 0 5 // Character Medley
00005: ~SETUP-AMBER.TP2~ 0 0 // Amber the NPC MOD for BGII:SoA
00006: ~CHLOE.TP2~ 0 0 // Chloe NPC mod v1.2
00007: ~SPELL_REV/SETUP-SPELL_REV.TP2~ 0 0 // Spell Revisions
00008: ~SETUP-BGTTWEAK.TP2~ 0 1502 // Make armor and shields shatter
00009: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 100 // Restore innate infravision to Half-Orc characters
00010: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 130 // Additional racial traits for Dwarves
00011: ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ 0 140 // Additional racial traits for Gnomes
00012: ~SETUP-NMR-V1.5.TP2~ 2 4 // NM-Relationship:Relationship system to the expansion of the original BG2 script.1
00013: ~SETUP-NMR-V1.5.TP2~ 2 10 // NM-Relationship:Relationship system core skills' hotkey "E"
00014: ~SETUP-XPMOD.TP2~ 0 12 // Reduce to 50%

Edited by EarthquakeDamage, 21 September 2009 - 10:54 AM.


#13 Arjento

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 06:17 PM

Just in case you not doing it right,

1) Select "Throne Of Bhaal"
2) "Single Player"
3) "Import Game"
4) Load your save
5) Wait for the Autosave to kick in
6) Go back to the main menu
7) Select "Baldur's Gate" (If you are playing from BG1)
8 ) "Single Player"
9) "Load Game"
10) Then load your save you used when you Imported

Hope this helps!

Edited by Arjento, 21 September 2009 - 06:46 PM.


#14 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 22 September 2009 - 12:56 AM

I don't entirely understand that TP2 stuff, but looking at the linked thread it appears to refer to the "someone keeps trying to perform some scripted action and ends up looking epileptic" stutter. I really wish we had distinct words to differentiate the two (or more?) different types of stuttering behavior.

Well, now you don't have to know anything about the .tp2 things anymore as I uploaded the LStest.zip that has the .tp2 code in it, you just have to install it, play the game, uninstall it and copy over the solution gained from the forum.
And by the way, the epileptic stutter and the slowdown of the whole game is generally caused by the same thing, one or more of the game scripts is dying to get a move on, but when it moves, it's conditions stand true and it tries to move again, causing it to stop, and when it tries to do this enough times it drings the whole game down to slow.
Of course there are other stuff other factors cause to repeat... but that's another problem.

Haven't been able to check out the save, will do it some other time, hopefully soon.

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#15 Darpaek

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 01:00 AM

The guy who discovered it is really a genius.

Yeah, you are.


Look J, I don't pee in your pool, don't crap in my Wheaties, k? :P

#16 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 03:38 AM

Could you EarthquakeDamage make a --change-log from the 'agen.bcs' and '0dv#gen.bcs' files?

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#17 EarthquakeDamage

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 06:25 PM

I think those are party AI scripts in the scripts folder and thus .bs files rather than .bcs. So I'll run changelogs with both extensions. Also in said folder I see a 0dw#gen but not 0dv#gen. So I'll try both of those filenames as well.

[codebox][weidu] WeiDU version 21100
[./Chitin.key] 494 BIFFs, 97504 resources
[./Dialog.tlk] 331757 string entries
[weidu] Using scripting style "BG2"
[1PP.TP2] parsed
[1PP_AVATARS/SETUP-1PP_AVATARS.TP2] parsed
[1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES/SETUP-1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES.TP2] parsed
[1PP_THIEVES_GALORE/SETUP-1PP_THIEVES_GALORE.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-NSCPORTRAITS.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-BP-BGT-WORLDMAP.TP2] parsed
[LEVEL1NPCS/LEVEL1NPCS.TP2] parsed
[W_GUI/SETUP-W_GUI.TP2] parsed
[GENERALIZED_BIFFING/GENERALIZED_BIFFING.TP2] parsed



Mods affecting AGEN.BCS:
[/codebox]

The only result that wasn't a carbon copy of that was:
[codebox][weidu] WeiDU version 21100
[./Chitin.key] 494 BIFFs, 97504 resources
[./Dialog.tlk] 331757 string entries
[weidu] Using scripting style "BG2"
[scsII/tra/english/english.tra] has 563 translation strings
[1PP.TP2] parsed
[1PP_AVATARS/SETUP-1PP_AVATARS.TP2] parsed
[1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES/SETUP-1PP_FEMALE_DWARVES.TP2] parsed
[1PP_THIEVES_GALORE/SETUP-1PP_THIEVES_GALORE.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-NSCPORTRAITS.TP2] parsed
[SETUP-BP-BGT-WORLDMAP.TP2] parsed
[LEVEL1NPCS/LEVEL1NPCS.TP2] parsed
[W_GUI/SETUP-W_GUI.TP2] parsed
[GENERALIZED_BIFFING/GENERALIZED_BIFFING.TP2] parsed



Mods affecting 0DW#GEN.BCS:
00000: /* from game biffs */ ~SCSII/SETUP-SCSII.TP2~ 0 5000 // Ease-of-use party AI
[/codebox]

Edited by EarthquakeDamage, 28 September 2009 - 08:54 AM.


#18 Martin27

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Posted 06 October 2009 - 12:11 AM

The "script stutter" you refer (the stutter you don't have) to is pretty obvious, and easily fixed with a stutter test.

The stutter you have, I call the "Aerie/Nalia Stutter" because I could solve it by Ctrl-Ying Aerie or Nalia (but it returned upon Rez).

Have you tried #20 on the stutter list? It personally worked for me, plus another has reported recently that it worked for them. You should try it. Even if it doesn't work, it's quick and easy just to try. The guy who discovered it is really a genius.


this worked for me, i wonder how such things can work.

#19 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 06 October 2009 - 12:53 AM

dplayer1.bcs

Mods affecting DPLAYER1.BCS:

That's plank, good. For the others, it might not be so good that all those mods affect them as they are not exclusively used by those mods.

this worked for me, i wonder how such things can work.

It probably has something to do with the in game saved data, that is forgotten by the game when you import the game to ToB. It could be the automated random dialog starting timer or something the like... I also rememberforgot reading that the ToB patch might have it's hands in the advancement of such a thing.

[weidu] WeiDU version 21100
...
Mods affecting AGEN.BCS:

That's a blank :huh:

[weidu] WeiDU version 21100
Mods affecting 0DW#GEN.BCS:
00000: /* from game biffs */ ~SCSII/SETUP-SCSII.TP2~ 0 5000 // Ease-of-use party AI

So you are using the E-o-u party AI's?

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 06 October 2009 - 01:02 AM.

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#20 EarthquakeDamage

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Posted 06 October 2009 - 01:33 AM

So, hey, more not-so-good news.

I exported my character and started a new game with him. I gathered a different set of NPCs then rushed through Nashkel, the Cloakwood, and so forth, all the way to Baldur's Gate. By the time I'd entered my fifth city district (mostly ignoring quest opportunities), the game was stuttering like hell again. No flippin' clue what's going wrong. Maybe the game fails to unload areas properly, so it keeps parsing the scripts for every area/creature you encounter?

So I scrapped that second run (keeping the first in case someone finds a cure for it) and started SoA with a new character. Turns out I'm stuck in the Promenade. The worldmap won't let me leave. Only the Arena (from whatever mod) is highlighted, and it's Unreachable. The Slums &c are still greyed out. If I MoveToArea to another district the worldmap works. In fact if I travel to Waukeen's I can exit normally. I just can't leave it the first time. Weird. At least I can work around this particular problem.

I hope I don't die a slow, stuttery death in SoA/ToB too. In years past (and past installs of a much less massive nature) the real stress test has been the Underdark, though I learned to avoid that by not carrying any containers.

... aaand the Hellstutter crept up on me after wandering around for a few days doing minor quests. Caught me mid-Planar Sphere, in fact. Seems the game's pretty much broken at this point. Maybe it's SCSI/II and their massive scripts doing it? Hell if I know. Could just be areas failing to unload/stop running scripts/whatever. I know I was hearing the town crier (the one that tells you about the Arena as part of some mod, not Town Crier N-whatshisname) from across the city for a while, even after returning to the Promenade and leaving it the correct way. He shut up eventually, but for a while there I could still hear him. Anyway, that's it for me for now.

Edited by EarthquakeDamage, 07 October 2009 - 02:14 AM.