12 replies to this topic

[melkor_morgoth75]

Hi all,

i'm wondering about a possible "update"/change about this mod i'm working on. I just didn't bother directly Erebusant for now, i'd like to ask and know community (and senior admins as well) here.
I'm quite close to have a "revised" version of DSotSC (as well other mods as The Vault for example). Revised means: balance the mod and avoid also ugly stuff in there. I've tried to change lot of overpowered items (currently also fixed some), spells (mostly just avoid installation of some spells) and stores. That means i didn't change ANYTHING regarding the plot, but i just "adjusted" (of course personally) what i "rated unbalanced" and ugly. Is that something possible to "share" in public? I'm really wondering about it, as i don't want to put changes on someone else's work (even if the mod has years of story...),

I won't release anything without having an approvement or be sure that i will not do anything wrong,

thanks for the attention, any feedback is welcome

mm75

[Chevalier]

My Thinking on this is that we should only: fix bugs and make compatibility fixes for abandoned mods. I also think it is alright to make mods that mod other mods. In this case something like 'mm75's DSotSC item revisions'. This way if people want the original game/mod they can play it. If they find it too unbalanced and can't leave the items on the ground then they could use your or others mods. Also remember that if you tone down the items then the bad guys that drop them will not be as tough.

I know many of the items were badly bugged before erebusant fixed them. I also think many of them are overpowered and I put them in my 'bag of holding' (until I find an opponent I can't defeat, Grey Clan has some really tough guys and gals, and out they come). If I ever play a game that I start from Candlekeep and make to ToB, I plan on using them after I get to the ToB part of the game.

[Miloch]

Mods like DSotSC and the Vault are pretty much in the public domain. What's more, they've been that way for years, the latter at least has even the author's blessing to be that way (possibly the former, who knows anymore) and various forums have their own versions of the mods. The SHS DSotSC is a good sight different than the original version - we had this discussion here a while ago (such as here for example).

So by all means, do as you will, make it public, but in my thinking, you should incorporate either a second option for the mod [i.e. Install DSotSC? 1) Original mod 2) MM75's "balanced" version]. Either that or a patch-type mod that just installs nerfed items or whatever. Not that you have to actually patch - overwriting is fine in this (one) case since whoever's installing it knows they're replacing stuff. So I guess more or less what Chev's saying.

Also remember that if you tone down the items then the bad guys that drop them will not be as tough.

I'm not sure I agree with that, since rarely do enemies use all the abilities of items and the difference between a +5 sword and a +2 one is pretty minimal in the hands of an enemy who's living on borrowed time one way or the other. Anyhow pretty easy to compensate by upping the CRE's STR or something, but even that won't make a huge difference. To really make them tougher, the focus should be on making enemies *smarter*, and SCS does a pretty good job of that as it is.

Oh and you should also get with OneEyedPhoenix who was looking at doing the same thing with respect to a revised sort of BP Balancer (which already sort of does this, but perhaps in a hackish sort of way by just removing some items). And see his original post here (under the name Draco) for some specific suggestions.

Edited by Miloch, 16 October 2009 - 12:48 PM.

[melkor_morgoth75]

I think it's beyond my skills to have in the same package (anyway i have to get in touch with Erebusant about that) my install and original install. Basically i have my modified tp2, setup.tra and some .itm, .cre and .are files ... any tips how can implement those without overwriting the original ones and have those in the same installation as the original?

mm75

PS: for those interested DSotSC revisited by mm75 is ready for testing.

[Miloch]

I think it's beyond my skills to have in the same package (anyway i have to get in touch with Erebusant about that) my install and original install.

Not really - you just have to use SUBCOMPONENT which is pretty easy when you get the hang of it. There are examples in the WeiDU doc and also some in the DSotSC tp2 itself I think.

As for getting erebusant's permission, well yes, if you can, but he basically just took over for SBB, who did so for someone else, so that really isn't an issue unless erebusant is actively editing the mod.

I wouldn't bother patching unless you're modding original game resources - if so, then DSotSC should have the code for that (well I know the Tutu version does - I don't know the BGT version as well). If you're just modding DS resources then don't worry about patching - just use SUBCOMPONENT or do your changes in a standalone mod, whatever's easier.

[melkor_morgoth75]

Thanks for the inputs Miloch!

mm75

[OneEyedPhoenix]

Hope you got my PM mm75.

Edited by OneEyedPhoenix, 19 October 2009 - 07:27 AM.

[Hoppy]

mm75,

There are some duplicate or very similar spells in DsotSC and TDD. Would you like me to compile a list of those for you and you can choose to remove them if TDD is installed? I just suggest that since recommended installs put DSotSC after TDD. Let me know and good luck!

Hop

[yarpen]

Don't you use NTotSC?

[Miloch]

Don't you use NTotSC?

Well, there are even more chances for toning down stuff there, though I've never played it, just have heard. NTotSC doesn't tone down DSotSC stuff, does it?

@Hoppy - that would probably be useful. All these mods should patch the same resource, or do IF checks (if the similar spell is already installed, don't install another version, or just patch the existing one) if you ask me.

[Hoppy]

@Hoppy - that would probably be useful. All these mods should patch the same resource, or do IF checks (if the similar spell is already installed, don't install another version, or just patch the existing one) if you ask me.

I will go through my list and see what mm75 wants to do with the duped spells. Also when I finsh the TDD updates I am doing (close) I will test install DSotSC after ( I need BGT anyway) to make sure SPELL.IDS isn't getting scrambled by duplicate refs. I had that in the previous DS version.

[melkor_morgoth75]

mm75,

There are some duplicate or very similar spells in DsotSC and TDD. Would you like me to compile a list of those for you and you can choose to remove them if TDD is installed? I just suggest that since recommended installs put DSotSC after TDD. Let me know and good luck!

Hop

Yup, just drop me a list (and a check please to see if TDD is installed) and i'll have a look. Anyway i just left only 9-10 spells available from original DSotSC

mm75

[Hoppy]

mm75,

There are some duplicate or very similar spells in DsotSC and TDD. Would you like me to compile a list of those for you and you can choose to remove them if TDD is installed? I just suggest that since recommended installs put DSotSC after TDD. Let me know and good luck!

Hop

Yup, just drop me a list (and a check please to see if TDD is installed) and i'll have a look. Anyway i just left only 9-10 spells available from original DSotSC

mm75

Actually I got ahead of myself. There are no "real" duplicates that are exact and may have minor differences. Not really worth the work for you to change since you were going to leave out some spells anyway. My concern was with filling the spellbook but is no longer a problem with Taimon's ToB hacks or the spells you choose to omit.

Good Luck!