23 replies to this topic

[temnix]

That topic about spells for non-casters in the Help section gave me the idea to make a spell that would let the caster switch between different classes. That should include the priest class, but for balance and conviction I would like to explain the spells the wizard would get as magic-user simulations of real priest spells, and to strike out of that list the Cure spells. So, is it possible to give people an alternative list of spells for this switch? I imagine it is, considering that druids are a "kit" of the priest class... right? And they get their own selection. Instead of a cleric, I would be switching the caster to a kit called "cleric" but actually with an altered list. Where are the priest spells listed, anyway?

[subtledoctor]

All priests spells are hard-coded to be added every level-up to all priests whose usability is compatible with the spell. Spells can have one of four usability values:
- cleric
- druid
- both
- neither

Druids are not a cleric kit, they are a class with priest spellcasting that is subject to the hard-coded "automatically add spells" feature. Their spelliat is governed entirely by the usability flag of the .SPL files.

[temnix]

Okay. That's perfect, actually! I don't need to think how to give priests my new spells now. They will be added automatically... wait, wouldn't that fill the spell scrolls with tons of priest spells? I mean, there are so many SPLs for them, wouldn't they all pop up in the scroll?

 

Anyhow, for my forced change to cleric it turned out that the character arrives to the cleric class without any spells in the scroll. Not surprising, really, but the simplest way to give him the right selection of spells (as I waited for the explanation on the list) seemed to be to just hand them over with "Give special ability." I gave the character Bless this way, and it stayed after the change to the original class, only shaded. I can select which spells to give - and, in principle, which to take away. This is thinking about other situations when a custom spell selection might be in order. Why not some spells just for paladins, for example?

Edited by temnix, 17 December 2017 - 05:50 PM.

[subtledoctor]

All the priest spells appear in the scroll at level-up only. If it's a temporary thing then you can add them with 171 and then remove them with 172.

Just watch out the player doesn't level up in the meantime, though. Maybe apply a 99% XP penalty for the duration... when the penalty disappears they will get all the XP they earned during that time and then can level up normally.

[temnix]

That's not how I'm going about it, I'm blocking XP accumulation with Immunity to effect, XP Bonus. That's for plot purposes too, the idea is that it's an alternative self from another reality. If a character levels up as a thief (another option) and then goes back to wizard, he gets to keep the combined mage-thief interface, so leveling-up had to be stopped. And without leveling-up characters don't get spells and other adjustments in the new class. Even Bonus priest spells doesn't open slots until they level up, so in the end I decided against spells in the new class. It's still a useful switch for Turn Undead and armor. But what's that you say about a 99% XP penalty? How do I do that?

[subtledoctor]

Opcode 104. It applies an adjustment to your current XP. You don't lose levels for losing XP, do it should be safe to use this opcode just drop all XP to 1%, and all incoming XP gain to 1%, so you'll basically never reach the next level. Then you can cancel the 104 effect (give it a duration, or else make it permanent until death and cancel the spell with opcode 321 later), and the character's XP will go back to normal, including any XP they earned in the meantime. So if you earned enough to reach the next level while transformed, the game will keep track and award you with that XP when the defect wears off, and then you get your new level.

Only issue is, there are some time when even a continuous opcode 104 effect takes a few seconds to kick in: when waking up from sleep and when entering a new area. You will see the "you can level up" message and then it will disappear after a couple seconds.

[temnix]

Thanks. Might use this sometime.

 

And what happens if the percentage is set to above 100%? The character will get free XP and levels for a while, then his total will drop back and he'll have to pedal it through the same numbers? This spell might be called "Unwarranted Ambition" or "Delusions of Grandeur."

Edited by temnix, 18 December 2017 - 01:12 PM.

[subtledoctor]

Yup. My mod checks you WIS score and applies continuous XP adjustments on the fly (WIS 5 = 75% XP, WIS 25 = 120% XP... Minsc pretty quickly ends up trailing a level or two behind everyone else ). If you encounter an enemy that can damage that stat, a secondary effect of the stat damage can be a pretty hefty hit to your experience.

Edited by subtledoctor, 18 December 2017 - 09:55 PM.

[The Imp]

Yup. My mod checks you WIS score and applies continuous XP adjustments on the fly (WIS 5 = 75% XP, WIS 25 = 120% XP... Minsc pretty quickly ends up trailing a level or two behind everyone else ). If you encounter an enemy that can damage that stat, a secondary effect of the stat damage can be a pretty hefty hit to your experience.

Fun fact about that, a temporary wisdom boost gives a temporary xp bonus, but the fact that it won't stay temporary as the character levels up and gains the level permanently.

[temnix]

Shouldn't it be the primary ability of the class instead of Wisdom? By PHB rules, Intelligence for Wisdom, Strength for warriors and so on above... 16, I think, should give 10% extra experience. That's probably not a good idea for these games, considering that everyone plays impossibly high-stat characters, but those are still the pivotal abilities.

[The Imp]

Wisdom has history with XP gain, from the PST. But the point in that was that memory would fade away while dying, but might not take it all away, if you were wise enough.

[temnix]

Torment isn't exactly canon... Oh, I don't mind Wisdom being used for extra purposes, only the other stats are underdogs again.

[subtledoctor]

probably not a good idea for these games, considering that everyone plays impossibly high-stat characters,

This. I just did it for balance reasons, to give fighters a reason to value WIS. INT provides a bonus to saves vs. spells and extra proficiencies; and CHA gives bonuses to the other saving throws, as well as Luck.

STR/DEX/CON are probably still way more important... but with my mod at least it's a tougher choice. And if you want to role-play non-minmaxed characters, you'll get some mechanical reward.

[temnix]

Either I didn't understand subtledoctor's explanation - though there's nothing to be mistaken about there - or he was wrong about how priest spells come to be in the priest scroll. He said above that I only need to make a priest spell, and if it's a cleric-compatible spell (for example), then it's going to be found in the scroll of clerics. Not so. I made a spell, and it's a priest-cleric type, and Branwen (just summoned with the console) doesn't get it either immediately or on level-up.

 

How is it really done?

[The Imp]

The divine spells are also subject to alignment (good/evil&lawful/chaotic) exclusion flags. Besides that, I would need thefiles to give actual advice. And if you have other mods installed, weidu.log's content. But it should happen normally, at the first level up, when the spell can be casted.

[temnix]

No exclusions. I plan to make it a druid spell, but for now there are no checks. It's a level 2 spell, I don't know what gives. Well, if you want to have a look at it... Drop these files in override.

Attached Files

•  ROBINC_#.BAM   2.04K   160 downloads
•  ROBIN1_#.SPL   7.98K   178 downloads

[The Imp]

Actually, never mind.

Edited by The Imp, 18 January 2018 - 09:22 PM.

[temnix]

You are full of shit, Imp.

[The Imp]

Erm, do you have also the robinb_#.bam -file in your override folder ? I ask, cause the spells casting icon is that, and should be at the spell book... The "never mind" was a comment I had to edit into the post as I was wrong in the innitialö posting of the comment so I edited it out. If you noticed. So I'll dismiss the reply.

Edited by The Imp, 19 January 2018 - 04:06 AM.