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Two questions about BWS


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#1 Creepin

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 04:48 AM

Hopefully there's still some experts left to know the answers :)

1. Is there a functionality implemented in BWS allowing to provide backup link for a mod, which should be used when BWS decide that the main link is unavailable? Like may be
Down=http:/ /mods.pocketplane.net/AlassaNPC_v3.zip;http:/ /some.other.place/AlassaNPC_v3.zip
Save=AlassaNPC_v3.zip
Size=2129400
or
Down=http:/ /mods.pocketplane.net/AlassaNPC_v3.zip
BUDown=http:/ /some.other.place/AlassaNPC_v3.zip
Save=AlassaNPC_v3.zip
Size=2129400
or any other way to the same end.

2. There's this short and obscure remark in BWS readme:
BWS/AutoIt3 goes online
The BWS will try to update the mods data when it starts a BWP install. This is done by looking for some files hosted in the internet. The BWS (which uses the AutoIt3.exe) will attempt to fetch these files from the servers and continue.
What mechanic is behind this description, what exactly is downloaded and where from?

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#2 ALIEN

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 05:14 AM

1. No. Even if it would prevent errors, it was never implemented because oblivious reason.

2.

BWS use git to preform auto-update every time when it start. The "some files hosted in the internet" are BWS files hosted at BWS github repository which are downloaded.

BWS use unix tool: wget.exe to download mod archives. The only things which will be updated are: filename (taken from web server response) of the mod archive (for eg: "Eilistraees Song v6.6.zip") and the filesize (bytes).

 

The documentation is indeed cryptic because it was mean to be written for non-tech user. What was you concerns?


Edited by ALIEN, 11 February 2019 - 05:25 AM.

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#3 Creepin

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 05:46 AM

That was super fast, thank you!

For #1, my concern is, obviously, providing a backup plan. Having backup download is 50% less useful if BWS can't switch to it automatically. Something akin to TheWizard's IEGMC mirrors (if you remember that ancient times). As for obvious reasons, these are not so obvious to me I'm afraid :(

 

For #2, I know that BWS will update itself if launched via "Update If Needed" option and will not update itself if launched via "Without Update" option. However that quoted snippet of readme made me think there might be another update at some later step of BWS logic because "when it starts a BWP install" is something user will select few steps after selecting which vbs file to launch BWS with. So, my concern is if it might so happen that even if I launch BWS with "Without Update" file something will be updated later as soon as I select "BWP install", erasing all my locally made changes to general or mod related ini files.


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#4 ALIEN

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 06:07 AM

1. I see. The reason was: no one is allowed to mirror mods without authors permission. But there is also another one: maintaining links for backup location adds two times more work, especially when shsforums.net link will download new version and mirror site link points to older version of the mod.

2. The whole description is more inaccurate than I thought. No, it won't touch any files (except downloading new mod versions) when you launch BWS via Without Update". I've updated docs.


Edited by ALIEN, 11 February 2019 - 06:09 AM.

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#5 Creepin

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 06:24 AM

1. I see. The reason was: no one is allowed to mirror mods without authors permission. But there is also another one: maintaining links for backup location adds two times more work, especially when shsforums.net link will download new version and mirror site link points to older version of the mod.

Still not so obvious: I'm sure that for each author who forbid backup download there will be about five authors who will be glad to have one, and for workload increase it's both minuscule and optional. Even with all these limitations were there such possibility implemented we could have curbed "I can't find mod X" down in about 4 times.

 

2. The whole description is more inaccurate than I thought. No, it won't touch any files (except downloading new mod versions) when you launch BWS via Without Update". I've updated docs.

Indeed BWS readme was very nice except for that exact section, so thank you for making it as clear as the rest of readme.


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#6 Creepin

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 06:34 AM

it won't touch any files (except downloading new mod versions) when you launch BWS via Without Update

Errm, no, wait! I've just reread carefully your reply... can you please elaborate this part?

 

Say, I do run BWS in "Without Update" mode and use its BWP option, and also say there exist, for the sake of example, 1PP v5.2.4.

If my local ini file says (within the same example) that BWS should go exactly to http:/ /www.shsforums.net/files/download/1006-1ppv410/ and grab there exactly 1ppv4.1.0-rel.7z file, is there any mechanic in force that will made BWS to download 5.2.4 instead of 4.1.0?


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#7 ALIEN

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 07:00 AM

it won't touch any files (except downloading new mod versions) when you launch BWS via Without Update

Errm, no, wait! I've just reread carefully your reply... can you please elaborate this part?

 

Say, I do run BWS in "Without Update" mode and use its BWP option, and also say there exist, for the sake of example, 1PP v5.2.4.

If my local ini file says (within the same example) that BWS should go exactly to http:/ /www.shsforums.net/files/download/1006-1ppv410/ and grab there exactly 1ppv4.1.0-rel.7z file, is there any mechanic in force that will made BWS to download 5.2.4 instead of 4.1.0?

It will download 1PP v5.2.4 as soon as it will be updated to 5.2.4. That's the whole purpose of stable/direct download links: always download most recent version of the mod. The 'Version' key is only text, its's used only to display mod version and it needs to be updated manually for each new mod version.

 

1. I see. The reason was: no one is allowed to mirror mods without authors permission. But there is also another one: maintaining links for backup location adds two times more work, especially when shsforums.net link will download new version and mirror site link points to older version of the mod.

Still not so obvious: I'm sure that for each author who forbid backup download there will be about five authors who will be glad to have one, and for workload increase it's both minuscule and optional. Even with all these limitations were there such possibility implemented we could have curbed "I can't find mod X" down in about 4 times.

But you don't know which one, neither BWS maintainers. It's not only maintaining links but also manually maintaining mod updates at the mirror site. Anyway, it's too late for discussion about BWS features.


Edited by ALIEN, 11 February 2019 - 07:21 AM.

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#8 Creepin

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 07:27 AM

Say, I do run BWS in "Without Update" mode and use its BWP option, and also say there exist, for the sake of example, 1PP v5.2.4.

If my local ini file says (within the same example) that BWS should go exactly to http:/ /www.shsforums.net/files/download/1006-1ppv410/ and grab there exactly 1ppv4.1.0-rel.7z file, is there any mechanic in force that will made BWS to download 5.2.4 instead of 4.1.0?

It will download 1PP v5.2.4 as soon as it will be updated to 5.2.4. That's the whole purpose of stable download links: always download most recent version of the mod. The 'Version' key is only text, its's used only to display mod version and it needs to be updated manually for each new mod version.

Ahha, perhaps I finally understand. You're telling about stable download links like that "/master" on GitHub, where never version replace older version under the same link as soon as never version released? That's something happening on the host side and BWS can not be held responsible for that, of course, and given update mention in BWS readme I figured it describes something happening on BWS side, like, if BWS might download new version of a mod even if older version mentioned in that mod's ini file is still perfectly available.

 

Anyway, it's too late for discussion about BWS features.

How so? True, I am definitely not the one even distantly capable of implementing that feature, but may be there is or there will be someone both capable and interested. BWS saw a good share of maintainers suddenly happening when all seemed to be lost :)


Edited by Creepin, 11 February 2019 - 07:32 AM.

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#9 ALIEN

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 08:28 AM

Anyway, it's too late for discussion about BWS features.

How so? True, I am definitely not the one even distantly capable of implementing that feature, but may be there is or there will be someone both capable and interested. BWS saw a good share of maintainers suddenly happening when all seemed to be lost :)

But that was when no one know that maintaining BWS require all of you free time and you soul for pointless and repetitive tasks. And no matter how many hours you will put into it, it won't be enough. None know how bad AutoIt language is and that it has no future thus it doesn't attract new developers anymore. Now we know so nobody should be asked to maintain BWS ever again, just as nobody should be asked to maintain "Mod list with links" anymore. It's pointless waste of time which could be used for other things. I wonder what agb1 and quiet could do if they would be still among us. If only we know what we know today...


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