8 replies to this topic

[Radagast-The-Brown]

The Baatezu are known to hate their cousins the Tanar'ri...this can be easily seen in BP...I don't know though the strange way Horred coded their scripts but it seems that they kill each other whether they r Baatezu vs Tanar'ri or Baatezu vs Baatezu or anything....(this makes the game very easy-at least in tactics the demons use gate and many other spell-like abilities thus making them a challenge anyway-these 2 races are supposed to be feared throughout the realms, however they die especially easy and usually they kill one-another making it a piece of cake and a lie at the same time)
It seems that their annoying habbit of throwing symbols and their gaze attacks make the other nearby demons (whether baatezu or tanar'ri) to all go hostile at each other and fight each other to the death...this can be easily seen in DD1000 (easthaven-alustriel quest) as well as in Riatavin and in Watcher's Keep when the demogorgon summons the infernal host (both Baatezu and Tanar'ri)...
't is strange that in both of these demon attacks instead of the demons being just Tanar'ri or just Baatezu, the mod-game makers did the huge mistake and added both...this of course leads to a sort of bug which in conjuction with their scripts, they kill whatever they find, even a Balor may fight one-on-one another balor...which doesn't make sense of course....

As an ad&d-p&p player for many years I do like a lot the relation between these two races and their hatred and all the Blood-war theme...but it seems that this CAN NOT be implemented in a PC game at least not without problems... Some things are just meant to stay just in p&p, never to be hardwired in a pc game...
Tis just my opinion though...

[Stone Wolf]

It can be put in, though. A simple alignment check to see if they go hostile works quite well. On the other hand, even fiends of the same type will turn on each other sometimes.

[Radagast-The-Brown]

It can be put in, though.  A simple alignment check to see if they go hostile  works quite well.  On the other hand, even fiends of the same type will turn on each other sometimes.

That is EXACTLY my point...It isn't natural at all for the demons to attack each other when they r same race...any baatezu or tanar'ri would prefer to eat any humanoid, a LOT before even trying to touch another fiend...This has just NOTHING to do with the cosmology of demons neither their bloodthirst or mania with fleshlings... anyway I still can't find even ONE reason why a baatezu or tanar'ri would attack another of its kind while there r so many humanoids out there to tear apart...

[Stone Wolf]

Most of the time they wouldn't, but if a fiend harmed another with an AE spell, for example, the harmed one could attack. Fiends kill each other for fun--especially Tanar'ri I think--so they won't always ally themselves. Yugoloths (which aren't in BG2) actually have a base 25% chance of turning on each other when Gated in.

[Radagast-The-Brown]

Most of the time they wouldn't, but if a fiend harmed another with an AE spell, for example, the harmed one could attack.  Fiends kill each other for fun--especially Tanar'ri I think--so they won't always ally themselves.  Yugoloths (which aren't in BG2) actually have a base 25% chance of turning on each other when Gated in.

Yeah this certainly is right about Yugoloths but CERTAINLY NOT on super-intelligent demons like balors and pit fiends or glabrezu...anyway it still sucks for a pc game which is already easy, to have monsters kill each other...it still is making the game worse that feature....

[mildImp]

Just thought Id chime in on this thread as I just had my first experience with gating in this incarnation of BP. What I experienced seems wholy unrealistic. The gate was opened, and out steped 4 Baatezu directly adjacent to my party. They all promptly attacked each other and ignored my party even after we engaged in the frey.

I dont know about everyone else, but this behavior seems self defeating and, quite frankly, boring. I am going to change this in my game, but it seems a reasonable change to make, IMHO, to the BP AI. When I first read this thread, I kind of ignored it, but after experiencing it first hand I had to weigh in.

Seanas or Hlid, is this change something you have considered or is this a modification you just aren't going to entertain?

Edited by mildImp, 05 November 2004 - 01:22 PM.

[mildImp]

Judging by the sinking of this topic on the forum, I guess the answer to my last question is a no.

[hlidskialf]

Not a priority at the moment, but maybe if another patch comes together.

[seanas]

actually, although you wouldn't be able to tell as i've not responded, this is actually something that i've been thinking about changing. i've noticed quite a few enemies (not just demons) attacking each other instead of the party, so i'm wondering if the problem isn't with the demon scripts as such, but with their use of an identifier that is incorrect, or something similar.

if it turns out that it's only demons, then i'm still thinking of preventing demons of one type attacking their own kind.