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Slowness with a modern PC

Started by brian3d, Aug 10 2013 02:27 PM

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#1 brian3d

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 02:27 PM

Why is my BG2 ToB running so slow on my system? Usually during cutscenes (for example Gorions death scene battle) do I experience these lags. As well as when you exit Irenicus' Dungeon and the Cowled Wizards are trying to restrain Irenicus but he's owning them all.  Tremendous slowdown there. Just to be clear I am running one a few mods in the following order:

 

BG2Tweaks

BGT

Bg1NPC

Bg2NPC

Crossmod Banters

Kelsey mod (Both for SoA and ToB)

 

 

My system is an Intel Duo Core 3.33GHz  5GB Geforce 570 GT. I am running Windows XP SP3, I have set the game options sliders in the BGConfig to Max on General, graphics, and sound.

 

Any other info you guys need I will gladly provide.

 

Thanks


#2 The Imp

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 04:06 PM

Reducing the lag in 25 simple steps. People, read the pinned topics, especially the ones that say to be FAQs.


Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#3 coineineagh

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 10:58 PM

Good list. I'll try these out as soon as possible. Never knew that MoveToArea cheat was so harmful - I'll avoid it as much as possible.

I installed my megamod game based on the 12.1 BWP guide, but even in Beregost in BG1, I'm already experiencing some choppiness/lag every second.

It's playable for the moment, but more lag can be expected later in the game. It's my own fault for installing over 2/3 of the mods in BWP.

 

I took a big risk, by including Improved Anvil 4.2 (old, less incompatible version) at the end as well. I read that it has lots of item checks, so maybe that's a culprit...

Unfortunately I wasn't able to use the cleanup.bat file, because all the latest BWP fixpacks are in .gzip files that for some reason won't open for me.

Would the cleanup have made a difference in lag, or just cleared up disk space?

 

Older BWP guides instead write about how you can remove all the old installer folders, .exes and .debug files, to clear up room. Is that still viable, if I'm sure I won't make any more weidu modifications to the install?


#4 The Imp

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 07:44 AM

Good list. I'll try these out as soon as possible. Never knew that MoveToArea cheat was so harmful - I'll avoid it as much as possible.

I installed my megamod game based on the 12.1 BWP guide, but even in Beregost in BG1, I'm already experiencing some choppiness/lag every second.

It's playable for the moment, but more lag can be expected later in the game. It's my own fault for installing over 2/3 of the mods in BWP.

 

I took a big risk, by including Improved Anvil 4.2 (old, less incompatible version) at the end as well. I read that it has lots of item checks, so maybe that's a culprit...

Unfortunately I wasn't able to use the cleanup.bat file, because all the latest BWP fixpacks are in .gzip files that for some reason won't open for me.

Would the cleanup have made a difference in lag, or just cleared up disk space?

 

Older BWP guides instead write about how you can remove all the old installer folders, .exes and .debug files, to clear up room. Is that still viable, if I'm sure I won't make any more weidu modifications to the install?

Erhm, do you have the ambient sounds off ? #4.2.

 

The Clean up .bat will probably just break your game ... it's the override folder you need to worry in size, not the game folder when it comes to speed, as that's the data not included in the Biffing that takesa longer to read than anything else, after all it's read twice or more times as such. The clean game folder comes to be a consern only if you wish to remove the excess stuff that won't be useful for you... but if the game lags, you are better of not cleaning it as you might throw away to fix too, like the Cleaner .bat has a tendency to do.

 

The Improved Anvil is not really compatible with most mods if any, I assume you are still at the BG1 portion of the game and so not in SoA where you would see the effects... I personally have never played the recent versions of it but it will make the SoA, not as hard as intended, but insane with idiotic creatures and pure cheats(spells etc) that the player has no access to. Yep, that's cheating.


Edited by The Imp, 24 August 2013 - 07:46 AM.

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#5 coineineagh

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Posted 25 August 2013 - 11:30 PM

The Clean up .bat will probably just break your game ... it's the override folder you need to worry in size, not the game folder when it comes to speed, as that's the data not included in the Biffing that takesa longer to read than anything else, after all it's read twice or more times as such. The clean game folder comes to be a consern only if you wish to remove the excess stuff that won't be useful for you... but if the game lags, you are better of not cleaning it as you might throw away to fix too, like the Cleaner .bat has a tendency to do.

 

The Improved Anvil is not really compatible with most mods if any, I assume you are still at the BG1 portion of the game and so not in SoA where you would see the effects... I personally have never played the recent versions of it but it will make the SoA, not as hard as intended, but insane with idiotic creatures and pure cheats(spells etc) that the player has no access to. Yep, that's cheating.

Thanks, I won't bother about cleaning up then. Yes, I just edited Baldur.ini to remove the ambient sound lag as specified in the anti-lag guide.

I just finished defragmenting this morning (first defrag in 6 months, so I'm hopeful it will have an effect), and I completed an antivirus scan this afternoon. A reboot-scan is currently in progress as well, to be safe.

I did generalized biffing already during BWP install steps, so my Override is quite small. Even temp and cache were tiny, but I'm only in Beregost after all.

I raised the cache size from 300 to 1024MB. Perhaps I can double it, but with all my system info on active memory, virtual memory and whatnot, I don't know what will happen if I accidentally set the cache to something larger than my RAM memory...

I wish I'd installed the pack mule, with all this talk of inventory items and bags of holding causing unnecessary item checks. I checked, and it seems Pack Mule is one of the last things in the closer installation. It should be installed after a lot of stuff, but no mention of it being important to install *before* anything. So, I'll try to install it at the very end, and see if it works on my present game.

 

I played improved anvil before.

http://forums.blackw....php/t3860.html

From experience I know that the old 4.2 version has tons of mods listed as incompatible, but mainly because they offer OP items that the ImprovedAnvil author finds cheesy, and refuses to offer assistance to anyone who installs them together with his mod. But his mod is really good in terms of battles, and Cromwell's new crafts. I took the risk of installing it anyway, even if there may be some incompatibilities. The newer versions offer new spells, and enemies 'cheat' even more. Especially since it overwrites old spells, there are added incompatibilities in versions 5 and up. But I still have the old 4.2!


Edited by coineineagh, 25 August 2013 - 11:50 PM.

#6 The Imp

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Posted 26 August 2013 - 05:13 AM

Hmm, I would like to give you advice on install order ... one that has all the mods covered, now if you wish, we can use Personel Mails for the specifics. As said in my FAQ guide, it's guite important to cover all the mods for the lagginess and the media files that the mods introduce are far worse than any other content that's added if it's not Generally Biffed...


Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#7 coineineagh

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Posted 26 August 2013 - 06:24 PM

That's very kind of you

 

Hmm, I would like to give you advice on install order ... one that has all the mods covered, now if you wish, we can use Personel Mails for the specifics. As said in my FAQ guide, it's guite important to cover all the mods for the lagginess and the media files that the mods introduce are far worse than any other content that's added if it's not Generally Biffed...

That's very kind of you. The advice seems to have worked out, especiall running defragmentation. Even my laptop's reaction time is so much faster than before. I guess it was more of a lack of general maintenance than any real lag on the install. The checks happen so swiftly now, I can barely spot the script-checking moments - smooth like a baby's behind!

 

Pack mule installed after all the other mods, but I have yet to return to the Friendly Arm Inn and actually try it out. I opted for bottomless bags.

I'd show you my weidu log via PM, but since my problem has been more than solved, I'd just be wasting your time. Your guide was a great help.

 

I predict that there might be a little slowdown by the time i reach Throne of Bhaal, but there's so much to do, and I'm such a slow player, that I doubt I'll need any help any time soon.

One slight thing that bothered me, though, if you care to listen: I noticed that my NPCs have strange dialogues. If I try to initiate dialogue with them in the party, they will either say nothing, or leave forever. If I boot them out of the party, some just stay put, and others leave (forever?). Tiax (mod places him in Beregost) leaves angrily, but that's no big deal. But Jaheira and Khalid also left, with no mention of returning to an inn or anything. I plan to keep Jaheira with me throughout the game, so I hope there's some way to prevent her leaving forever. Otherwise I'll never be able to dismiss her - not until her dialogues change in SoA anyway.


Edited by coineineagh, 26 August 2013 - 06:37 PM.

#8 coineineagh

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Posted 04 September 2013 - 09:43 PM

I just spoke with Thalantyr for the first time, and after his story dialogue the Thalantyr Mod kicks in. But it's all garbled characters. The only things I can make out are the '+1' and '+2+' parts of the dialogue. Same thing for item descriptions. Crafted items seem to be usable, but I can't read anything in the description box. Did I accidentally install the wrong language for the mod, perhaps chinese or russian?

My WieDU log - i can't find the spoiler tags...

Spoiler


Edited by coineineagh, 06 September 2013 - 10:46 PM.

#9 The Imp

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Posted 05 September 2013 - 02:51 PM

This:
~SCSII/SETUP-SCSII.TP2~ #0 #10 // ?????? -> : ???
is definitelly a bad sight ...
Other than that, you did not have the BWP Bork/Trim pack, and it seems you don't have the BWP Fixpack either, so you have the game files biffed a few extra times, and you might have a lot of unfixed features that are likely to cause bad things.... and the Improved Anvil won't probably help either... ouh, and you don't have the ToBEx that can help to debug errors...

Ouh, and this:
SETUP-BGTNEJ.TP2~ #0 #0 // Continuous and Custom Kit Imoen

Will likely bug your BGT to BG2:SoA Transition because it cheeses/overwrites an important file.

Edited by The Imp, 05 September 2013 - 02:56 PM.

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#10 coineineagh

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 12:57 AM

This:
~SCSII/SETUP-SCSII.TP2~ #0 #10 // ?????? -> : ???
is definitelly a bad sight ...
Other than that, you did not have the BWP Bork/Trim pack, and it seems you don't have the BWP Fixpack either, so you have the game files biffed a few extra times, and you might have a lot of unfixed features that are likely to cause bad things.... and the Improved Anvil won't probably help either... ouh, and you don't have the ToBEx that can help to debug errors...

Ouh, and this:
SETUP-BGTNEJ.TP2~ #0 #0 // Continuous and Custom Kit Imoen

Will likely bug your BGT to BG2:SoA Transition because it cheeses/overwrites an important file.

I know what caused the SCSII thing: I installed an old version, then I read about how the new version allows you to treat Cleric/Mage HLAs as abilities instead of Lvl9 spells. Since it was so far back in my installation, I decided to simply remove the old install folder, and replace with the new ones of SCSII, just to install the new component, which you'll see much later in the list. Anyway, I saved the old SCSII folder, so I don't know if that might help with any rolling-back situation or not. Perhaps the ??? already indicates that the damage cannot be undone.

 

Perhaps there will be a lot of bugs along the way, but I did use fixpack files by following the instructions in the BWP pdf. So although I didn't use the .exe batchfiles, most of the fixes should be in place. I did it by hand.

 

Yes, a lot of the BWP features were not installed, or installed based on an old version of it. The newer versions are downloaded as .gzip, and for some reason I can't unpack those. I did get .zip files frrom Leonardo's german site later on, but it was too late by then.

 

As for the NEJ transition thing: Imoen won't appear properly? I think that component was overwritten by my customized Imoen from Level1NPCs. I'll be very careful during the transition, then.

 

I was really pleased by the gameplay offered by Imp. Anvil last time I played a megamod back in 2008 - despite having overpowered items, the IA enemies were quite challenging. Not entirely bug-free, but enough fun to pick up again. The author unfortunately doesn't support his mod in a megamod of any kind, unfortunatley. There's no info on how to get it set up in any megamod, so I had to do some guesswork. I was fortunate enough to have kept the old IA 4.2, a very old download of the mod. By the time I was playing it in 2008, it was already replaced online by 5.0, which rewrote existing spells, adding much more incompatibility to IA.

Now, I've set up the megamod mostly as BiG World Project recommends, with the exception that I added Imp. Anvil near the end. I still had to compensate for annoyances, like the absence of the Shield of Balduran, Cloak of Balduran and Cloak of Non-Detection, which IA deletes from the game. Thankfully there is override folder, for reintroducing the lost items. At least now I know why I could never find those items back in 2008!


Edited by coineineagh, 06 September 2013 - 01:20 AM.

#11 The Imp

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 08:48 AM

Ah, darn, you transition should be fine... now that I look at it... as the BGTNEJ is instlled before the BGT...
Yes, a lot of the BWP features were not installed, or installed based on an old version of it. The newer versions are downloaded as .gzip, and for some reason I can't unpack those. I did get .zip files frrom Leonardo's german site later on, but it was too late by then.
Erhm, but the fact remains, the fixes in those packs are constructed for the install time... they won't work the same in the after install, as they fix what's broken in the install... so you will get lesser of an exerience from the whole of the game if you do it yourway....

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#12 kreso

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 08:27 AM

The lag in your game is likely to be caused by Improved Anvil flooding your baldur.bcs file with script checks for equiping items "non-usable by UAI" and CLUAing them in. Try editing the abovementioned file (and baldur25.bsc as well) and see if there are things such as 

IF player1 has item equiped s!sw1h01.itm then .....

Feel free to delete them all. The less baldur.bcs is overflown, the better the game runs.

Also, TB Tweaks may cause lagging.


#13 coineineagh

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 08:46 PM

The lag in your game is likely to be caused by Improved Anvil flooding your baldur.bcs file with script checks for equiping items "non-usable by UAI" and CLUAing them in. Try editing the abovementioned file (and baldur25.bsc as well) and see if there are things such as 

IF player1 has item equiped s!sw1h01.itm then .....

Feel free to delete them all. The less baldur.bcs is overflown, the better the game runs.

Also, TB Tweaks may cause lagging.

 

This is great stuff. I wish there were more actual compatibility info on Imp. Anvil like this. I'll be sure to make the deletions!


#14 kreso

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 10:58 PM

Just be careful! Don't delete everything there :D . But those "anti-cheat" measures should really go with your ammount of mods. 

Most of the TBTweaks are covered by ToBEx now, in a more elegant manner so switch to that.

Apart from that, Jarno wrote a guide to reduce lag. 

One important thing - sounds. Don't forget to turn them off in setup. If you're playing in 3D, newest drivers are recommended (I only got to play in 3D a month ago, otherwise the lag was enormous even tough I have 2,4 GHz and 3GB RAM).


#15 coineineagh

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Posted 08 September 2013 - 10:19 PM

I'm looking for baldur.bcs & baldur25.bsc, and the only things I can find are the Baldur.ini, Baldur.err, Baldur.txt and Baldur.exe

Is it located in another folder? I couldn't find it with windows search... could it perhaps have been biffed?

 

 

I got the impression from reading the BWP pdf, that ToBEx had a lot of compatibility issues. But re-reading the latest pdf, it just seems that it has lots of overlapping tweaks with other mods. Since 2 ppl are now recommending it, I guess it should be installed. :hug:

 

I also found out that one of my favourite weapons is from a mod called Killing Wolf NPC, which I didn't install this time yet.

 

Both KWolf and ToBEx don't add any new maps, and I can't think of any reason why I can't install them at the end. Would that be safe to do? :Poke:

Thanks again for all the help, guys!


Edited by coineineagh, 08 September 2013 - 10:30 PM.

#16 The Imp

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 02:33 AM

I'm looking for baldur.bcs & baldur25.bsc, and the only things I can find are the Baldur.ini, Baldur.err, Baldur.txt and Baldur.exe
Is it located in another folder? I couldn't find it with windows search... could it perhaps have been biffed?
Dah, you need moding tools to actually modify the games script files... dah. And you can't just go and go with a heavy and and hope, you have gotto know what you are doing...
I got the impression from reading the BWP pdf, that ToBEx had a lot of compatibility issues. But re-reading the latest pdf, it just seems that it has lots of overlapping tweaks with other mods. Since 2 ppl are now recommending it, I guess it should be installed. :hug:
Well the thing is, you can try to fix everything in the game and some times you succeed, and others you fail, you can re-try but without seeing the whole interraction you won't ever get it right.... now the mod is in a beta phase just like all the other major mods today, it will get cleaner as the versions rise, but it might need tweaking... and actually the SCS and a few other mods need it to do it's job to actually work, as some of their code is based purely on the ToBEx's versions included in the mod itself, as in mini ToBEx's ... that install themselves if the ToBEx is not installed before it. Which is the reason why I wouldn't recomend installing the ToBEx at the very late stage.

Edited by The Imp, 09 September 2013 - 02:44 AM.

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.

#17 kreso

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 03:23 AM

Umm....I assumed you have NearInfinity and some knowledge of using it. What you can do:

-uninstall Anvil and see if the lag is fixed - if not, then it's irrelevant.

If yes....ummmmm...well, I could edit Anvil installation manually and send it to you via e-mail (it would cost me no more than 2 minutes of my life!) but I don't have v4.2 which you are using. :P

Or, you can download NI and hand-edit baldur.bcs and baldur25.bcs.

As for ToBEx and KillingWolf - install them both. None of them will mess up your install.

ToBEx ideally goes first, but nvm.

You might however, redo your installation for those ??? marks - those aren't good.

ToBEx is shipped with SCS afaik, so it should be installed already but it's ok to install it seperately.


#18 coineineagh

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 04:48 AM

I installed Kwolf and ToBex last, and when I opened the game, I think it was a tiny bit more lagged than before - it wasn't significant enough for me to be certain.

If there are indeed mini Tobex's installed with SCS, then that might cause the slowdown. What do you guys think? I liked the tweaks, though, so I hope I can keep it.

Yes, I have NI, and I half suspected I'd need that or ShadowKeeper to find the bcs. I should've checked before asking unnecessary questions. :new_bottom:

 

I checked out the BCS scripts, and they're quite large. There are just a few entries for the old Imp. Anvil 4.2, and they all look like this:

 

IF
    PartyHasItem("S!sw04") // Judgement Day +5
    OR(2)
        GlobalLT("Iajdplot","GLOBAL",2)
        Global("Ianojudgement","GLOBAL",1)
THEN
    RESPONSE #100
        TakePartyItem("S!sw04") // Judgement Day +5
        DestroyItem("S!swo4")
END

If I delete them,it would just give me duplicate items after crafting with Cromwell, am I right?


Edited by coineineagh, 09 September 2013 - 05:05 AM.

#19 kreso

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 05:13 AM

Those would destroy these items if you obtained them by cheating.


#20 coineineagh

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 11:48 PM

I edited them out, as well as scripts designed to prevent Use Any Item rogues from wearing the mod items, and a script that would kill the PC if he has cheated in more items than he could normally possess. Deleted the entries from Baldur.bcs as well as Baldur25.bcs.


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