17 replies to this topic

[psiclops]

Sorry the ideas weren't in my last post, but it's too late now.

Outside of NPCs I'm considering, there are two ideas I've got that I wouldn't mind some opinions on. Mainly I need to know if these are possible, or should be dropped right away.


First, the Chataeu Customiser (Customizer for you USAites)

I was surpised that this isn't a frequently occurring idea, but what's to stop a program adding NPCs other than Minsc or Jaheira into those cells in the first dungeon? I just played BG1 with Tutu and thought how stink it would be to have Edwin and Viconia in your party and not have them rejoin in a believable way.

In a nutshell. Could Jaheira be replaced with Viconia in her cell? Could Minsc be removed from the dungeon and Edwin be put in the open cell opposite to you?

This would probably mean no burning at the stake (unless the victim became another drow, and trying to save her would expose Viconia's presence too, making the ensuing fight more necessary). Is it possible to remove or alter such sequences?

Edwin would have to be replaced with another non-joinable evil-mage for the Mae'var quests? Is this possible?

Korgan seems easiest to port into the room, but I can't see a reason for Jon to have captured him... (like he needs a reason to be bad

There wouldn't be much dialogue to do. I don't think this is a dumb idea (whereas the next one might be) so I really need feasibility comments. (Eg this will take 2000 hours)


The maybe dumb idea (very involved long-term project, perhaps impossible)

Scary Aerie (or Evil Aerie maybe)

This idea came from a comment by canman on the Bioware forums discussing resurrecting Aerie if she was the victim of Bodhi's transformation. He said, "It is too bad you have to kill her. Bodhi could teach her to be a good little vampiress. " and I can't stop thinking about changing her into a vampire from this point in the story.

Some ideas and points to consider so far:

- If you intend to play an evil (or netural) PC and install this mod, you discover a ritual to restore Aerie's life but not reverse the vampirism, so you sort of had a Bodhi for yourself...

- Make her take damage in sunlight of course.

- Some kind of vampiric melee attack to spice her up!

- Romance would ideally continue and be rewritten from this stage.

- Perhaps it's easier to end Aerie as far as the engine is concerned, and have her a 'slightly' altered person and yet totally a new character (this would make install/removal much easier I guess)

- Apparently Viconia and Aerie can be kept together in a party up to this point but I've never tried it.

- canman suggested that you, "might have to give her a little blood now and then to keep her happy." Could this be effected using a Larloch's minor drain effect + 1 round bleeding damage? I think the power of your blood provides a good incentive for the new Aerie to stick with you, as she would be attracted to your power. She'd need a reason because...

- I think it should be a major personality shift like Gandalf in LOTR and that she only vaguely remembers her Aerie-life...

Gandalf the Grey
Gandalf the White

Aerie the Yellow
Aerie the Red

- This would preclude Minsc being in your party from here on (if ever), as I don't think he would kill his second witch, yet she would be his racial enemy etc... However, Minsc could then be added into BG2 as an NPC who pops up with some undead hunters to kill Edwin (in case you took him in BG1).

- I've tried to suss out how it could be made 'Aerie-specific' and only have one real idspellholdstudios.netspellholdstudios.netea so far. This would mean having pure-elves immune to the complete cure available to Jaheira, Viconia (and Anomen?!!?) somehow. I suggest that because elves are resistant to charm, maybe Bodhi's had to employ more powerful and binding magics to convert Aerie. This magic has affected Aeire so deeply that the vampirism can't be removed without killing her permanently. Then the post-death quest would stay the same for everyone. Please hack this idea to death

- If they can be in the same party it'd add another evil NPC to the standard set, and gives you one pure mage, one cleric, and one mage/cleric, plus korgan, pc and sarevok with only standard NPCs, not that I think this would be everyones party. Which brings up OTHER NPCs - most especially Valen from a topical perspective! Though I don't see a problem with an alternative vampire (as some people probably won't try Valen) having 2 vamps in one party could be cool, but would require lots of work.

- Voicing is a huge issue. Rest of game would have to be revoiced by someone who sounded like a vampiric version of Aerie. Hard, but do-able long term... (She can't say "Oh my!" or "I'm so happy you brought me with you." or even "I won't let my friends be hurt!" (Especially if she drinks a few of your HP each morning!))

That's enough ideas to chew on now. I'd really appreciate anyone's feedback, even if it's just to beg me not to change Aerie because you love her or whatever...

I did a very rough version of her protrait change to see how I'd approach the eyes and teeth, but I say again it's very rough - and the teeth will be hard to get perfect (at the moment they're just drawn on in white... shoddy)

Here's a before and after concept...



Looking forward to hearing any ideas!!

Edited by psiclops, 25 August 2004 - 01:28 AM.

[BobTokyo]

1) Keeping your BG1 party: Should be possible. Easy enough with Edwin (requires re-writing Maevar's quest) and Vic. The rest of the BG1 NPCs are easy to port over, but will require large amounts of dialog and some side-quest re-writes to really fit in BG2 (Aerie's quest needs re-writing if you port over Quayle, the paladin quest needs one small tweek if you port over Ajantis, etc.).

2) Evil Aerie. Possible, no harder than most NPC projects. Much of the content might have to be in TOB, as there isn't that much left to do in SOA by that point for many parties.

[psiclops]

Thanks for the reply! Your optimism is truly inspirational

1) Excellent. Will work on planning this straight away. People have suggested importing you whole BG1 party. Maybe when the BG1 PCs are all available for the sequel we'll have something to scan our final saves and put them all into BG2 for us, which would be cool!

I think just trying to get Edwin and Viconia in will be hard as a beginner - but I'm sure to learn a lot trying! (God, I sound like Imoen - Heya, it's me, psiclops - dear oh dear.)

Eventually a rescue Xzar and Montaron from Spellhold to give an evil team an NPC incentive to go?


2) You didn't mention whether this was dumb or not

I think it would be hard based on the rightful demands of the vampire loving community to get it right. Whilst un-vampiric myself, I realised when Scary Aerie was born, that I know a few people who qualify, and thankfully have talent and lots of creative writing skills. First thing they teach you in writing school - Write about the vampires you know... (and get them to read your drafts).

Voicing seems easier when I think about them too...


Just thought of a terrible pick-up line:

According to an online AD&D personality-type test I'm a Chaotic-Good Elven Mage-Bard... you?

[BobTokyo]

1) I think that this project would be easier to do by giving people a choice of NPCs to be in the cages as they install the mod. The easiest way to do it would probably be to expand on the similar components in BP-BGT; I think that Hlidskialf is the current custodian of that mod while Horred is off modding for NWN, so you might want to contact him. This is by far the bigger of the two projects.

I think letting the Evil team go for revenge or power works better than a rescue, but that's just one opinion.

2) I don't use Evil CHARNAMES or NPCs that often, so I'm the wrong one to ask if the project is silly. It is possible, and there will be an audience out there for it. Voicing will sound best if you replace the entire Aerie voice set, but giving Vampire Aerie a new voice would work as well, and it would take less effort.

3) I usually test out as a LG Mage-Bard, but it has been a while. Probably a thread or two on that test still floating around somewhere.

[psiclops]

don't use Evil! don't use Evil! Whad'ya mean don't use Evil?!


Nah same...

Good of you to reply. I don't mean actually importing your BG1 versions of Edwin and Viconia if it sounds like that... just relocating BG2 versions. And further NPCs would be separate projects.

Thanks for the contact info...

Can't re-voice all of Aerie because I'd lose my favourite line of the game:

Peeing underground is just not for the Avariel...

You know it true

[Lady LeFay]

*giggle* 'peeing underground'?

I ususally test out as a LG Half-elf Paladin/Bard of Mielikki -- sounds like a possible child of my Bhaalspawn and Pally mod if one got a sex-changed.

Evil Aerie? Hell, it may make her less irriating for me. (*hate the bubbly whiny types*)

YES! I see my suggestion had occur in other places about the party selection. (I personally love to see Kivan or Xan in the cages instead of Minsc and Jaheria... kinda got bored with them).

[psiclops]

Yeah I have subsequently stumbled accross that thread, so I feel very last week.

But seeing as the idea had already gotten so big, it would be nice to bear in mind as an ultimate transition mod for the future. Where a program scans your final save, inserts all you NPCs into BG2 flawlessly (and believably) with all the 'dead' ones having been acted for BG2 or both.

It is way beyond my understanding of the engine to think about that at this stage though. I just wanted a simple evil alternative for when I play throguh properly as evil for the first time... and it was a good way for me to do it without spoiling Vic or Edwin for me. (I would obviously have to get dialogue after more play with them...)

Still - if the load/in and out system is easy enough, who knows?


I will redeem Aerie in the eyes of her detractors by making her a monster.
Muhahaha!


Here's an idea for my evil CHARNAME necromancer/master (this could be a necromancer or evil-cleric only mod perhaps haha)

Attached Files

•  psiav.jpg   0bytes   0 downloads

[Lady LeFay]

oooooh, Romany.

[Archmage Silver]

"Oooo!" as pikel would put it. An impressing image.

[SConrad]

Here's an idea for my evil CHARNAME necromancer/master (this could be a necromancer or evil-cleric only mod perhaps haha)

While I'm fond of the ancient Roman mythology, as well as Joaquin Phoenix's acting, and the movie Gladiator, I'd say that you probably want to look over the portrait. For the mentioned reasons.

But that's just my opinion.

The rest sound like very good ideas!

[psiclops]

yeah... you're probably right... it was geeting late and my eyes were blurry




No one wants romans in Faerun of course. I'm not that great with pics, but i might just use him as a model for a painting perhaps... I don't want to identify the pic as Lucius Veras each time I see the PC, that's for sure!

Thanks for your feedback... although I am surprised by all this positivity! Why isn't work like this!?

"To typing! With no regrets!"

[Lady LeFay]

*giggle*

Bother!

Edited by Lady LeFay, 24 August 2004 - 08:48 PM.

[Deathsangel]

To be honest. I think the DD already let Montaron and Xzar be in the cells instead of Jaheira and Minsc. And I thought of doing something the same perhaps with my mod (Darkness in Light (see forum at IE mods in progress)), but using unused evil NPC's form BG1 like Shar-Teel in stead of Minsc and perhaps Eldoth, though I think you can even use Jaheira to some extend.

There are two mods about Kivan and there is already one for Xan (see stands than at the gates)

[psiclops]

Thanks Deathsangel... I'll track them down and then I'll be able to see how to do it!

Excellent. Till we meet on my final day...

[NiGHTMARE]

I have a list of mods which bring BG1 NPCs to BG2, which you can find here.

BTW it hasn't been updated for a while, and a couple of the links (specifically the forums for Star Dragonmaiden's Kivan and Cliffette's Shar-Teel) need to be altered. There are also a couple of others not mentioned on the list, but that's because they're both OMG S3CRIT!!111 for the time being.

[psiclops]

Once again that's very helpful and much appreciated. Sincere thanks to all.

I think I'll run into Kivan - I know I've been on another board and seen that project briefly, but the love was apparent! Shar-teel mod won't get too many bad hits from Google I bet!

I'll right a prog to pop in your preference and call if 'front-end loader'


Quiet... Super-secret project in progress...

[Rastor]

Good of you to reply. I don't mean actually importing your BG1 versions of Edwin and Viconia if it sounds like that... just relocating BG2 versions. And further NPCs would be separate projects.

If that's all you want, I could do it in about ten minutes. It's just a matter of moving GLOBALS (via MoveGlobal() scripting action).

Here's a before and after concept...

I don't know... the vampiric Aerie really shouldn't have such tan skin.

[psiclops]

vampiric Aerie really shouldn't have such tan skin

I agree and well spotted!

I realised it shouldn't be too much of a stretch to program, but some cool dialogue in the dungeon (with Edwin especially, who is oh so happy to have wound up there, thanks to you) would make it take longer.

I didn't expect it to be very hard (only quite hard), as I'm still getting my head around the tools, and getting familiar with the file-types and stuff. As well as reading a lot too!

If it doesn't take long to replace them if no dialogue, I'll have a go at that as a self-tut. Truth be told, I'll work mostly on the 'Quit yer' complaining' mod (working title) first up, cause I think it has a much broader appeal, and fixes a good, but poorly implemented feature of the original games.

Your suggestions are worthy and welcome