36 replies to this topic

[Littiz]

Almost.
I could patch Shapechange to prevent the use of Energy Storm (meaning that you'd waste the attempt).

I kinda dislike this kind of solution when it's avoidable, since to do things properly I'd have to patch the existing spell entirely via WeiDU, and adding an entire effect is a bit tricky... yes, I am lazy...

[Rathwellin the Bard]

Spells are automatically disabled during shapeshift.

Any way to code this as a spell ... or, horrors I know, you could actually make it a spell instead of a innate.

[T.G.Maestro]

you could actually make it a spell instead of a innate

No.

I get the sounds before the visuals manage to start.
Might be different for another machine, but it just doesn't seem a perfect solution.

Might be, though I'm sure it would run smoother on a faster machine. I have no problems with game speed and animations on my computer (2.4 GHz), not even when using the most visual-heavy spell combinations with different/multiple characters.

I could patch Shapechange to prevent the use of Energy Storm (meaning that you'd waste the attempt).

If the "speed-problem" remains, I fear we don't have another option...

[Littiz]

If the "speed-problem" remains, I fear we don't have another option...

Please define "we".
()

[Rathwellin the Bard]

More cheese! Yum yum! You can even eat this one without crackers.

1. Cast Chain Contingency *whatever* + Tensor's Transformation + Maze on Self when Helpless.

2. Equip Ring of Free Action.

3. Use Energy Storm.

Energy Storm works normally, but since you have the Ring you aren't stunned when it first goes off. This is important since it keeps the Chain Contingency from triggering and it also lets your Sorcerer do things like move around and attack.

Finally the Sorcerer takes his damage and gets KOed. Since he's finally helpless the Contingency kicks off. Whatever the first spell is goes off then the good stuff. Tensor's doubles your PC's HP and it doesn't matter that your spells get disabled by it since ES does that anyway. Then Maze strips spell effects. The combo of Tensor's + Maze seems to heal the sorcerer of all damage suffered from the Energy Storm *and* he is safe from harm while he is supposed to be unconscious.

B)

This cheese comes at a price though. Once the Maze effect ends the PC's green circle is *gone* ... and his movement stutters a bit. However this is easily fixed by saving your game and reloading it.

[T.G.Maestro]

A few spells should definitely be patched to be incompatible with ES - I'm talking about any kind of shapechange/transformation spell/ability, including the Slayer form. While I don't like to do things like this, I begin to see that this is truly a must.

[Userunfriendly]

Hmm. Or maybe I have an alternate solution for this one, but only for the Simmy-cheese: I can make it so that ES can only be cast at a specified (high) level, so Simmies with 60% exp wouldn't be able to use it. This solution is far from perfect though.

greater or lesser restoration cast on the simmy will prevent that solution...

it sure seems like regeneration and improved haste cast on the sorc will prevent death...i mean regeneration as per the spell makes you almost immune to death in the game...

i wonder of resilient globe would be able to cheese it...free action a mage or sorc, and use doom to lower their save...have the mage or sorc cast resilient globe, you're now immune to all magic cast at you...but you can still cast magic at enemies while englobed...

might try spell immunities...the damage the sorc takes may be stopped by spell immunity...littiz??? is the damage effect a spl file???

now here's an idea to prevent clone abuse...make the first effect of the energy storm a non-descriminating death spell...insta kill all summons, including images and simmys...

yep, i am on both sides on this...i like cheese, but i also like modders...

[Rathwellin the Bard]

I seem to recall Littiz posting that Simmys were immune to summon death effects unlike PIs.

Edited by Rathwellin the Bard, 03 May 2004 - 08:46 AM.

[T.G.Maestro]

might try spell immunities...the damage the sorc takes may be stopped by spell immunity

It won't protect you from the damage .

[Rathwellin the Bard]

TG do you say this because you strip the spell protections or because they aren't spells?

One of the next cheeses I was going to try was to equip the Ring of Free Action, wait until the strip ended (or right before), & then use a Spell Immunity Scroll....

Oh, and if I recall UU has been known to code in immunity to certian effects on his PCs.

Edited by Rathwellin the Bard, 03 May 2004 - 10:44 AM.

[T.G.Maestro]

Hmm, this one can help us quite a bit with the Simmy cheeses I think (quoted from the bigg):

The spell Simulac.spl controls the changes that are done to a simmy when he is created. Put there a "set AI" effect, and you are done.
Mislead.spl for Mislead, Project.spl for Project Image.
Notice: since this spell is shared between you AND the enemies, edit these spells ONLY if you do that for player's simmy's AI. And put a "If myself enemy and not charmed or dominated, then set script NULL" line at the beginning of the script, so that enemy's clones won't attack their masters

I think this way we can disable quite a few "illegal" spells/innates (like ES) for Simulacrums.

TG do you say this because you strip the spell protections or because they aren't spells?

They are counted non-magical spell effects.

[Rathwellin the Bard]

Hmm.

Would that be compatable with the gMinionC scripts from http://home.earthlink.net/~cirerrek/ ???

[T.G.Maestro]

Farnkly, I don't know - I never used those scripts.
Littiz?

[Userunfriendly]

TG do you say this because you strip the spell protections or because they aren't spells?

One of the next cheeses I was going to try was to equip the Ring of Free Action, wait until the strip ended (or right before), & then use a Spell Immunity Scroll....

Oh, and if I recall UU has been known to code in immunity to certian effects on his PCs.

any effect that is included in the game afik can be "nerfed" by an affect...

i once took a look at preserving boots, and made a pc immune to breach, ruby ray, etc....

ok, so if the damage caused on the caster by energy storm is NOT a spell, that means its going to be one of the standard damages the game engine can inflict on a character...

like elemental damage, or magic energy damage...

this implies that with a little looksee with near infinity can determine what exactly the spell does to you, and an appropriate immunity/resistance spell will stop it from hurting the caster...

i suspect rath has already tried protection from magic energy...

and spell immunity??? I suggested experimenting with spell immunity since in hell, you can block the game from taking away stat points on the selfish test by casting spell immunity divination..apparently the mechanism by which the game engine takes away stat points from the pc is a divination spell...

if its some damage effect, you should be able to block with a resistance spell...
if its a spell that takes away hit points, it might be possible to either make yourself spell immune to the school, or possibly exploit potions and devices to resist magic...

rath, images can be killed by true sight, dispell magic and death spell...

i've seen simmys killed by death spell...

oh yeah, guys...the spell description for true sight says simmys are killed by true sight...

"The spells that are affected by this are: Refected Image, Invisibility, Mirror Image, Non-detection, Improved Invisibility, Shadow Door, Mislead, Project Image, and Simulacrum."

so change the spl file for true sight, as per the description in the game, then have energy storm cast true sight...

that would stop image and simmy energy storm bombs..

[Rathwellin the Bard]

i suspect rath has already tried protection from magic energy...

Actually I hadn't. For some reason I aways forget those scrolls. I am but a minor cheese to your masterlyness UU.

Anyway tried it out. The neat thing is that you can still launch Energy Storm while protected by the scroll ... however it doesn't block any of the damage or other scripted effects.

Apparently you can cast the Chain Contingency + Tensor's + Maze chees *while* protected by the scroll too.

[Userunfriendly]

i suspect rath has already tried protection from magic energy...

Actually I hadn't. For some reason I aways forget those scrolls. I am but a minor cheese to your masterlyness UU.

Anyway tried it out. The neat thing is that you can still launch Energy Storm while protected by the scroll ... however it doesn't block any of the damage or other scripted effects.

Apparently you can cast the Chain Contingency + Tensor's + Maze chees *while* protected by the scroll too.

try mirror image...if its some sort of damage affect, mirror image may be able to block it...it blocks area effect spells like inc cloud, skull trap, firestorm...

I really like your cheese discovery using maze in chain contingency with energy storm...

[T.G.Maestro]

try mirror image...if its some sort of damage affect, mirror image may be able to block it...it blocks area effect spells like inc cloud, skull trap, firestorm...

Won't help either...