204 replies to this topic

[jcompton]

"Ah, my hound, this city be the great world of commerce.  Perhaps we can sell Jaheira?" are the ones that I will not forget easily.

"Perhaps we can sell Jaheira?" is, in fact, one of the game's all-time lines. And it's a good indicator of the difference between telling a story vignette and simply hammering on those obvious quirks.

After all, that exchange boils down to "HD and Jaheira do not get along because he is arty and favors Chaos while she is earthy and favors Balance," but it's much, much more entertaining and valuable than some ham-handed attempt to get them to talk about balance and chaos and artiness and earthiness.

[Delight]

I think that making mods that are part of BG1/BG2 story is an overused idea.

[Theodur]

In that case, I'd say that making BG-based mods as such is an overused idea.

[Delight]

I think that we need more TCs.

[Kulyok]

I think that we need more TCs.

Now, *that* is an overused idea.

[Delight]

TCs don't require from player to play the same game thousand times.

Edited by Delight, 23 October 2005 - 11:42 AM.

[Kulyok]

For me, the reason is simple: Baldur's Gate was written by professional writers, and had heaps of quality dialogue. TC is a fan-made product written from scratch, i.e. unknown quantity. A mod for BG1 or BG2 draws more attention from me because, well, you cannot screw Imoen or Edwin completely, can you? But a TC? I do not know.

[Delight]

I think that TC's are usually too big.
Small TC may be more enjoyable than a big one or a BG-enhancing mod.

[SimDing0]

For me, the reason is simple: Baldur's Gate was written by professional writers, and had heaps of quality dialogue.

Yes, it definitely takes the skill of a professional writer to bring us dialogue of the calibre of Bondari and the Chinchilla.

[Kulyok]

(groan) Not THAT professional! No, Bondari, Cespenar and Spectator are firmly on top of my "make a working mod which takes them out of the game, and I'll be forever grateful" list. With Chinchilla, I was more lucky: I never bothered to explore the area, until one unhappy day...

But well, even professional writers have a sense of humour (for want of a more expressive word), don't they?

[SimDing0]

Of course, what you really mean is that, yes, professional writers can produce stuff every bit as terrible as the worst rushed mod.

[Theodur]

But well, even professional writers have a sense of humour (for want of a more expressive word), don't they?

And we know that humour has no place in games such as BG and its mods, yes?

[Kulyok]

Of course, what you really mean is that, yes, professional writers can produce stuff every bit as terrible as the worst rushed mod.

Exactly.

Unfortunately, as it is much easier to produce horrible stuff than the opposite, a TC conversion is more likely to end up with the quality far lower than the desired level than with that of the professional team.

[Kulyok]

Try to define a professional team - if you mean people who are payed for their literary output, then... you see, Salvatore is a professional writer. 

I think Bioware's level is a pretty good starting point.

[Kulyok]

Yes, I appreciate BG1 somewhat more, too, though it had some not-exactly-perfect moments, as well as BG2. (Larry, Deryl and Deryl come to mind.) But in BG2, the writers had more leeway with the characters, while in BG1, they invested into the setting. Perhaps we prefer to have the ready setting and to let our imaginations run wild with the characters? But that is off topic already.

Anyways, in answer to your question: an NPC with BG2 level of development(Viconia, Valygar) in BG1 setting(freedom, mystery, realism) would be a nice example of Bioware quality for me.

Here's a non-overused idea, though: bringing BG2 a NPC into BG1. It would not work without modifying both games' dialogue, but it could work, I suppose.