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#1 Daulmakan

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 04:00 PM

Hey there, as the title goes, I got some random comments and possible typos for you:

SPOILERS AHEAD, of course.


* The cutscenes are very nice (the animation for Seida?s Runes gets a :new_thumbs:), although sometimes they went awry, like Seida never giving his final speech, or not all the party members being teleported to his location area (this is particularly bad when it happens to Kiyone, for if she?s not present when Myroven & Brega arrive, you?re stuck in that area). I know the last thing is already reported and using MoveToArea(?Z#0041?) solves the issue, but not everyone knows that, and if possible, solving this issue could save a few reloads (and possibly spare some swearing ;)).

* When talking to Cromwell about upgrading Kova & Kiyone?s items, it sets off his entire dialogue for all the other upgradeable items in the game after that, which can?t be skipped. Could this be changed?

* Their items respawn everytime they?re missing from their inventories. So everytime one of them dies and gets resurrected, they immediately gain another set. Isn?t there another way to handle this to avoid the multiplication?

* The ReadMe states that the Improved Statue of Riddles (neat modification, BTW) is removed from Beyond the Law, but Riddles.d still remains in the mod?s folder (not that it takes that much space, of course, just for the sake of cleaning).

* When rescuing Adylin, one of the assassins became unkillable several times. I wasn?t able to reproduce exactly the necessary conditions, so I can?t tell why it was, but out of 6 or so tries, half of the times he became unkillable.

* After Kova?s trial, Bylanna?s dialogue became messed up (Anomen repeating his murdered sister questions and gaining XP again, plus the option of having Kova stand trial again).

* The Kova raid parties are pretty fun at first, and they might catch you at an awkward moment, so that?s a plus. However, even though they scale in power, there?s a point in which they become a nuisance, given the repetition of the encounters and the advancement of the plot (you'd think all those Shadow Thieves I wiped out could've been better use against Bodhi or at some other venture). Couldn?t they be disabled, at least in Chapter 6?
This becomes more of a bother when one uses the AdvanceRealTime command to trigger banters.

* I didn't get to see their romance, perhaps because of the bugged conversation you mention in the mini walkthrough? (needless to say, I didn't know I needed to change a Global). Is this still the case? If so, it merits fixing, IMO.

* I'd support the idea of having the option of doing the quest without the NPCs present in the party.

* I was playing with Rogue Rebalancing, so I had to spawn Arledrian via console. Any chance of swapping him for another character to do the dirty work?

* What are you plans regarding the ToB portion?


Now, for the typos:

From Interj.d:

~Here, sir. This amount of gold should be more than fitting for the momento of your daughter.


From KovaB.d:

== Z#KIYOB
~We're expected to keep our cases confidential, unless we're working with someone o n it. I didn't have all the details with me, either.~


== Z#KIYOB
~Because he has been wronged and is I have to redress that.~

Not completely sure about this one. Does the 'is' make reference to the fact that he is currently being wronged in the present? If so, a punctuation, comma, or adding an 'and' might be better. Otherwise, removing it sounds fine.

== Z#KOVAB ~Last I checked, I've got Korgan's trusty axe for that, but I could be mistaken. The main thing that separates me from being mincemeat is that I'm on your side, and I am grateful~

Final dot missing.

== BJAHEIR ~And yet we all know that your expressed interest was solely to show him innocent of the accused crimes before the courts of law, with relevant evidence.I wonder who you serve, child. I think you serve yourself, rather than the righteousness and truth you claim to cleave so closely to.~

A space is missing.



From Kova.d:

== Z#KIYOJ
~Thank you, my lady Bylanna. I am most grateful~

Final dot missing.

= ~If you wish me to, I can take you to where the witness it, and make sure that none of us are being followed. Otherwise I will be there waiting for you, to see to it that nothing untoward happens.~


IF ~~ THEN PRISONK1 seidacaptive
~I'm afraid not, my <PRO_LORDLADY>. The court has ordered that he be kept in a special high security prison, away from those who might try to rescue or kill him before his trial.~

The above token doesn?t return anything in the prison keeper dialogue. According to the IESDP, the correct form is <PRO_LADYLORD>.


As a final note, regarding the characters themselves, I found Kova to be likeable, while Kiyone reached Anomen-levels of annoyance for me :D. Also, I believe sometimes they get unnecessarily verbose, specially at the beginning. I found such talks to be more interesting/tolerable after a while, when their personalities had already been better established by the banters with the other NPCs (granted, it was just Jaheira and Anomen in my run, plus the PC) and their interjections throughout the game. I thought the dialogues that worked best were the more casual ones, the ones dealing with their attitudes and the thoughts behind them, rather than a philosophical exposition of them, like the breakfast ones were, for an example of the former. Well thought and to- the-point sentences like "Even with reading and my other pursuits, I had quite a lot of free time while among the Shadow Thieves. Besides, it was good to give them another reason to keep their knives out of my back" can sometimes do wonders for the exposition of a character. Perhaps a bit more of that and less 'talking but no saying' could work better, I think.

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#2 Zyraen

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 05:34 PM

Thank you, I'll fix the typos and *try* to address the verbosity. However, for some of the bugs I've been tearing at my hair and won't be able to prevent them from happening ^^;; especially the Seida Finale and the Romance Bug... ARGH!

That being said, I can make the romance run a lot faster and also reduce the number of conversations required to advance the Romance to the level that you'd see the Wedding. I will also test the Wedding portion rigorously. The opening number of words have also bugged me, so I will definitely alter their joining dialogues to some degree.

Cromwell's items is pretty much irritating as differing versions (post x-mods) are pretty different. What I can do is to completely fix it by Cromwell speaking a totally separate dialogue when he is talking to Kova or Kiyone. It might make things weird, but its better than overlapping with the already tonnes of upgrades in Cromwell's default dialogue.

Edited by Zyraen, 31 March 2008 - 05:35 PM.

kiyos.jpg____btlbn2.gif____kovaS.jpg
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#3 Zyraen

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Posted 27 April 2008 - 08:11 PM

Just to give an update.

I've recently been doing rewrites of BTL Banters between Kova and Kiyone, and will probably soon move on to their non-Banter dialogues (ie the J file dialogues). While doing all this, it also helps me to get a feel again for them so that I can complete their already partially-done ToB Banters.

Some of the changes I think we'll be seeing is

- overall reduction of verbosity. many self-describing terms like "I think" "you might" etc will be removed completely, especially as Kiyone is often quite assertive. especially so for the joining Dialogues
- shorter banters. many subject matters will be shortened in terms of number of "Continue" you have to click, by about 30-40% overall.
- clarity. some of the terms they use to indirectly snipe at one another will be more obvious

- less "control-wrenching" interjections from Kiyone (less, but not a total absence. she will still respond strongly to some events)
- reduced number of Banters. talking more saying less in here, most of the "saying" dialogues in philosophy will be reduced in number. the leisurely ones will largely remain untouched
- randomisation - instead of starting the romance with 7 banters, it will start with 2 out of the first 4 banters, followed by 3 banters that will certainly happen. after that, instead of 6 banters randomised out of 8, it will be 4 out of 8, before the final banter where they cement their friendship (ie setting their Romance Variable to 2). This should make the romance run faster for most players, cutting out 4 banters, and all existing ones will be shorter as well, and providing possibility of new content in repeated playthroughs
- some ToB Banters will fire while in SoA if you play for an extended time after the Trial Ends

- Dialogue for BTL Item Upgrades will only be possible if Kiyone or Kova talks to Cromwell. Some hints will be improved (ie made more obvious)
- options will be made to do the BTL Quest to some extent (minus some of the plots that would not make sense, such as the Pursuit, Kharen's ambush and Finale) without Kova & Kiyone being in the party
- fixes will be made to the Finale to prevent things from going on during the cutscene (such as Assassins killing the party off or Mages casting spells while the cutscene of Seida being defeated is shown)
- I will do my best to prevent any party members from being "stranded" during the Finale ^^;;;
- I will do my best to make sure the marriage cutscenes ALL happen after the defeat of Jon Irenicus
- I will try to make it easier for you to make the Decision in the first 3 parts of BTL that will lead to you being able to access the 7th part of the BTL Quest, after the Finale, where you can finally make Corneil eat his words...
- will fix the Rogue in Adylin's portion
- Arledrian issue has more or less already been discussed with the writer of Rogue Rebalancing, and will remain as is for BTL.
- extra components will be included to provide Options for the Pursuit, such as Disabling All Pursuit, Disabling Pursuit after Chapter 6, and Limited Pursuit (ie the Cowlies will only send at the most 4 groups after you, the Thieves will send at most 7 groups)

kiyos.jpg____btlbn2.gif____kovaS.jpg
Love between a Law Enforcer and a Fugitive - can such a thing even happen?
SoA Release - Overview / Download Links

Zyraen's Miscellaneous Mods - Ust Natha Accelerator, item tweaks, XP caps, The Ub3r Reaver Kit, and much more...
Spellhold Gauntlet - more than just a Spellhold-Be-Gone
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#4 Zyraen

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Posted 27 April 2008 - 08:16 PM

In ToB what there tentatively will be is...

- Banters (more like Arguments...) with each other about (disagreeable) Life after Marriage - Partially Done
- Banters with each other about their own histories and why they were how they were during BTL SoA
- with the PC about the PC's history (they never really asked about in SoA, unlike most NPCs...), where the battle for the Throne is taking them
- various Reappearances by the Antagonists of BTL, not so much with a beefed up horde like in BTL SoA, but with more specialised and powerful allies, and at *extremely* inconvenient times
- (very tentative) sidequest involving a group of Sentinels

kiyos.jpg____btlbn2.gif____kovaS.jpg
Love between a Law Enforcer and a Fugitive - can such a thing even happen?
SoA Release - Overview / Download Links

Zyraen's Miscellaneous Mods - Ust Natha Accelerator, item tweaks, XP caps, The Ub3r Reaver Kit, and much more...
Spellhold Gauntlet - more than just a Spellhold-Be-Gone
Hidden Kits - hidden dual-classed kits with a twist for progression


#5 Daulmakan

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Posted 27 April 2008 - 08:37 PM

:coolthumb:

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