658 replies to this topic

[Archmage Silver]

Just got this in my email... so if you don't mind some EA spam, and like bonus items, check it out:

[Darziak]

Looks like you have to have facebook to "like" it.

[Archmage Silver]

Nah, it just looks like it, although they almost got me with that as well.

Just click the "Like" button once, then go back to the main site, fill out the newsletter subscription form with your BioWare Social Site email & password, and then click the "Subscribe to Newsletter" button. After you've done that, you should see a message stating that your account has been updated.

And if you didn't know that you had an EA account:

This site uses EA accounts behind the scenes, so creating an account here involves creating an EA account.

Edit: Just for the record, I've never had a Facebook or Twitter account (or whatever have you), so moving towards using those for game promotions is pretty annoying.

Edited by Archmage Silver, 19 August 2010 - 01:17 PM.

[theacefes]

The trailer was very pretty...but then again so was the one for DA:O and the game was certainly not up to date on its graphics. If they can give us anything close to ME1 at the very least I'll be happy.

[Kulyok]

I really don't like this "only a few people get these weapons" or "you can get these items only if you pre-order". Aren't all players equal? Don't all of them have the right to enjoy the game fully? (And believe me, there's a big difference between playing a rogue with an Edge dagger or playing a rogue without it). Besides, it all winds up on torrents anyway.

[Solar's Harper]

Well you could say they are "Gaining more money... by any means necessary!"

Poorly tasted play-offs aside, it's pretty much standard fair nonsense that even pre-dates the "Must DLC" era, uber items or boosts to whoever gets in first and sucks to be the rest. Besides they've probably locked half the stuff away again, for future DLC purposes naturally. Although all considered, in the long run, I wouldn't be surprised if this turned out to be another re-run of what happened with DA:O's Collector's Edition.

[Cal Jones]

Ah, I almost never buy Collector's Editions - I usually wait for the game to be a few months old before I buy. That way it's £10 cheaper, should have the major bugs patched and will have several walkthroughs done (not that I feel the need to cheat, as such, but I don't like to miss stuff by accident).

[Darziak]

Just got this in my email... so if you don't mind some EA spam, and like bonus items, check it out:

Apparently I got that email around 12:00 today.

I really don't like this "only a few people get these weapons" or "you can get these items only if you pre-order". Aren't all players equal? Don't all of them have the right to enjoy the game fully? (And believe me, there's a big difference between playing a rogue with an Edge dagger or playing a rogue without it). Besides, it all winds up on torrents anyway.

I think things like this belongs more to an MMO.


Seeing as they adopted some of mass effect things I hope they don't go the way of armour or weapon packs dlc.

[Archmage Silver]

News:
Preview @ RPS
Hands-On @ Kotaku
Bullet-Point Preview @ GamePro
Updated Hands-On @ GameSpot

I really don't like this "only a few people get these weapons" or "you can get these items only if you pre-order". Aren't all players equal? Don't all of them have the right to enjoy the game fully? (And believe me, there's a big difference between playing a rogue with an Edge dagger or playing a rogue without it). Besides, it all winds up on torrents anyway.

They (EA, BioWare) are the corporate content providers, and they'll only adhere to the law (apparently that's somewhat blurry as well when it comes to international business), so they're not really interested in any kind of "moral" rights, even if individual employees care about such things. They're in it to make a profit. These comments by David Gaider in "The old Bioware is dead" topic summarize the point pretty well.

Besides they've probably locked half the stuff away again, for future DLC purposes naturally.

Um... what did they lock away last time? I mean, I can see why you'd say that, but it's not really a factual statement, not even close. There's a deadline on adding content to the game before they start printing copies, and stuff like Shale would just be cut if they weren't turned into DLC. They couldn't finish Shale in time for her to be added to the main game, much less any of the other DLC packs.

I know Obsidian got really busy cutting stuff from KotOR 2, so I think it's better if BioWare at least releases their content in some form. Sure, they could release it for free, but why on Earth would they do that when they can release it and get paid for their work? And I'm not even a fan of DLC, but facts aren't going to change simply because the truth isn't to our liking.

[theacefes]

I agree with AMS as well as most of Gaider's points. I don't post much anymore but I am going to make my stance clear on this, hoping that someone out there will listen and see some sense in it. SHS mods feel free to move this to a different forum - I apologize ahead of time if it's not in the right place.

Lately, all I see are people complaining about the DLCs or the way that Bioware has been making games and then I see the same people posting fanfiction, screenshots, and walkthroughs for the games that they were talking so much crap about. The point is that at the end, you are either going to buy the game/DLC or you are not, but slandering and talking crap about the company that helped inspire the creation of this modding community because they didn't check your Santa Claus wish list before putting millions of dollars into their next project (the industry is a business) is frankly bull**** and I'm tired of all the bitterness I've seen from people (both here, the other modding sites, and the bioware forums) that used to seem so eager and happy about games. That's why we're here isn't it? To make a good game better?

Me? I love Mass Effect. I enjoyed DA. I buy all the DLC because they are good fun games that I enjoy and still have the right action and RPG elements that make a game fun for me. If it's not someone's cup of tea, no one is holding them at gunpoint to play them. Baldur's Gate will always have a place for me but I am not naive enough to think that with technology the way it is that every game coming out will cater to a particular niche. In the meantime, that is why the modding community is still around. And if you're still not satisfied...make your own game!

And lastly, if you *don't* work in the industry, please do your research before making assumptions on how game companies (both indie and non) develop and publish their games and their motives behind it.

Posting your opinion on a game is one thing - no one has to like a game - but don't be a hypocrite.

Thanks.

Edited by theacefes, 21 August 2010 - 03:54 PM.

[Solar's Harper]

Besides they've probably locked half the stuff away again, for future DLC purposes naturally.

Um... what did they lock away last time? I mean, I can see why you'd say that, but it's not really a factual statement, not even close. There's a deadline on adding content to the game before they start printing copies, and stuff like Shale would just be cut if they weren't turned into DLC. They couldn't finish Shale in time for her to be added to the main game, much less any of the other DLC packs.

I know, and it was during the initial burst of DLC that occurred way back if memory serves correctly, much of the content we were receiving was supposedly in the game already, just not complete by the end result standards. And from a business perspective... or any perspective really, making money is naturally a good thing, and if you can squeeze out more, go right ahead. Don't have to like it, but it's not an instant thumbs down unlike what some have been lead to believe, no doubt through the fault of us cynics not coming across properly.

And of course, if I misinterpreted, Bioware and Co. get a full apology for it by default. Though I hardly see why they, or anyone else for that matter would listen to me if it isn't something they want to hear - Plus Bioware isn't defenceless y'know.

And Ace, far as I'm concerned, it's simply a matter of holding them to the values and standards they set, not otherwise. Content could be a dog wearing a pink dress playing volleyball for all I care, but as long as it's labelled that and not some pigeon movie hero in a re-run of the Jetsons , criticism and praise 'til one up and chokes on that last meal.

And please, don't try the whole "you're not forced to play" motion, it's a black hole on any side. It's not like we're forced to talk either, yet we do it because no one fancies the alternative world view.

In summary, I guess my statement could mean: Cut the crap people. Say it like it is, and let history be the judge on who's right. Besides I do believe we're going off track, yet again.

[KIrving]

The point is that at the end, you are either going to buy the game/DLC or you are not, but slandering and talking crap about the company that helped inspire the creation of this modding community because they didn't check your Santa Claus wish list before putting millions of dollars into their next project (the industry is a business) is frankly bull**** and I'm tired of all the bitterness I've seen from people (both here, the other modding sites, and the bioware forums) that used to seem so eager and happy about games. That's why we're here isn't it? To make a good game better?

It's great that you're happy, theacefes, with BioWare products and you are gaining pleasure from playing their games. In some ways I wish I could still feel that.
Also you are right, they are a business and profit is the bottom line. Eventually many of the people that are complaining will stop buying and the BioWare nostalgia factor will lose influence. BioWare are clearly going for a particular audience and they will probably get it. Feedback, criticism, whinging, talking crap, whatever anyone wishes to label it however, is a valid and important form of consumer sentiment. I think that EA are big enough and bad enough to be able to take it on the chin and BioWare have cast their lot into the big corporate end of town for good or ill. I thank them for their legacy but I'll judge them on what they produce now and in the future not on how much I love their past games or how their games have influenced the creation of a modding community.

And if you're still not satisfied...make your own game!

Easily said. If I were sitting on a spare mil. I'd probably seriously consider it. Personally I see something positive in BioWare's new direction. I hope it will lead to enough frustration that more independent games get support. I know that the last game I purchased was from an independent developer because the game ticked off points on my "Santa Claus wish list".

Posting your opinion on a game is one thing - no one has to like a game - but don't be a hypocrite.

True. I criticized aspects of Mass Effect, back when the game was in early development. I loudly complained about the marketing direction when it was first proposed, the same direction that the marketing for DA2 is taking. I did not buy Mass Effect or its sequel. At this stage I am unlikely to buy DA2. I will continue to criticize or praise what I read or see of DA2, though.

[Vicen]

Not to derail the "Lovely" Discussions that have been recently partaken of but I find it out the emails are going out at random times...When Archmage Silver posted of himself getting the email I got it about 3 days later at around midnight my time...I wonder why they are sending them to various people at certain points earlier then others...I am sure it does not mean much but regardless I find it a wee bit odd...

[theacefes]

And if you're still not satisfied...make your own game!

Easily said. If I were sitting on a spare mil. I'd probably seriously consider it. Personally I see something positive in BioWare's new direction. I hope it will lead to enough frustration that more independent games get support. I know that the last game I purchased was from an independent developer because the game ticked off points on my "Santa Claus wish list".

To be fair, it doesn't require anywhere near a mil to create a game...unless you already have it all planned out. Of course, costs for games vary greatly as you probably know.

[Archmage Silver]

However, I do with that they would put out something more . . . substantial to grab people's interest with.

The popular idea these days is that if you make a game too complex, it won't sell as well, which is kind of true, RPGs being a niche market, especially if you don't make them appealing to a larger playerbase like BioWare is now doing.

[Kulyok]

I'm thinking it's not so bad to appeal to a larger player base - after all, House M.D., Sherlock and Matrix appeal to a wide audience, too. But what's bad is that they are giving us bad news(Hawke=pre-determined character, pre-determined biography, no choice), and none of the good news(like, what was Flemeth's voice doing in that trailer?).

[Archmage Silver]

News:
Preview @ IncGamers
Preview @ Strategy Informer
EA GamesCom Chat Transcript @ EA

I'm thinking it's not so bad to appeal to a larger player base - after all, House M.D., Sherlock and Matrix appeal to a wide audience, too. But what's bad is that they are giving us bad news(Hawke=pre-determined character, pre-determined biography, no choice), and none of the good news(like, what was Flemeth's voice doing in that trailer?).

It's not generally a bad practice, but movies and TV series hardly compare to the interactive entertainment that RPGs are, although you might say that they're getting closer where BioWare is concerned (see cinematic storytelling). As a side note, Black Adder > House M.D. (both are excellent though). There's always a decree of depth lost with every new RPG, or at least that's how we generally perceive it, having played the best of the genre.

To use a metaphor, what's a regular album when you've listened to the greatest hits one? Only one that offers something entirely new will be considered more interesting, which was the case with DA. Now that the second game in the series is more of the same, but with more predetermined decisions (loss of depth), it's automatically considered inferior, or that's how I see it anyway.

Edit: The loss of the top-down tactical camera isn't that great either.

Edited by Archmage Silver, 24 August 2010 - 03:15 AM.

[Kulyok]

I see what you mean. (Hmm, must check out Black Adder, then!) My only hope is that Baldur's Gate 2 was a continuation, too... but, of course, it's silly of me: in Baldur's Gate 2 you could play the same character and continue your character's story, whereas in Dragon Age, you obvoiusly won't be able to.

[Galsic]

Oh how I loved the tactical view .

I don't mind the predetermined character as he/she seems to be in DAII, but this may stem from my background of lots of console RPGS paired with a distinct lack of table-top action. And, from the sounds of things, I'll still be getting significantly more freedom in character development in DAII than I did in any of the console games I've played (some of which I've thoroughly enjoyed, too). I'm cool with that.

I'm more concerned with the battle and stat/ability-based char development aspects of the game. I was pretty spoiled on the top-down camera view and not just for the BG nostalgia. Also, regarding items and abilities, I REALLY don't want anything like what happened from ME1 to ME2 to happen in DAII. Don't dumb things down for me. That's all I ask ! Give me that and the game will be mildly promising for me.