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#821 Valamyr

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 12:22 AM

Soo I got this! I love the new interface and all and I gambled that we'd see further support and that modders would eventually want to take advantage of the new possibilities this project opens.

But I'm a bit at a loss as to whether or not I actually want to play it :P I cant fathom replaying BG1 without some critical core mods like "BG1 NPC project" that make the story so much better.

Even though I'm not an expert about BG mods beyond using many on a few different installs, I was hoping it might be relatively easy to somehow install weidu mods on top of this, but looking at the very different file structure in the BGEE directory, I'm worried it may be more difficult than I had anticipated. There's not even an override directory anymore...

#822 Ascension64

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:11 AM

Give it time. Mods will come.

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Note: I do not respond to profile comments/personal messages in regards to troubleshooting my modifications. Please post on the public forums instead.

Baldur's Gate Trilogy-WeiDU and Mods
Throne of Bhaal Extender (TobEx)

Contributions: (NWN2) A Deathstalker (voice acting) - (IWD2) IWD2 NPC Project (soundset editing) - (Misc) SHS PC Soundsets (voice acting)
Legacy: (BG/Tutu/BGT) Beregost Crash Fixer 1.9 (18 Jul 10) - (BG2) Enable conversations with charmed/dominated creatures (18 Jul 10) - (BG2) Experience Corrections (18 Jul 10) - (Misc) Platform Conversion Utility RC2 (13 Feb 10)


#823 Yovaneth

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:17 AM

Better than that, I'm already aware of some in preparation.

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#824 Maanape

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:36 AM

I wish some modder could say anything about the file structures: are they very different than the previous one? Are there any modding tools or native editor? Did unknown fields become evident now? Did they externalize more of the hardcoded data? This could give a hint about what the new wave of modding could do in the future.

#825 Zireael

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:48 AM

Is it true that there are many bugs in BGEE?

#826 Dakk

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:55 AM

I watched a live LP for a few hours (http://sv.twitch.tv/ctsnicky - it's under "videos" now, if you want to watch for yourself) immediately following launch, and I noticed the occasional non-gamebreaking bug. So from what I can tell a blanket "it's bug infested!" statement doesn't seem true.

What is apparent however is how much mods improve the game! I cringed at a few things vanilla throws your way...

#827 Tzarnal

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 04:15 AM

I've seen some issues in my playing last night, nothing thats beyond redemption. The separate THAC0 display is inaccurate. When hiding side panels you can get graphical glitches. The spellbook spell icons are of rather bad quality. The journal doesn't scroll by mouse but is set to tablet style dragging. The zoom level resets on zone changes.

It lacks polish, this is really annoying since it lacks polish after its been delayed to be polished more. On the other hand most of my issues are general engine issues, things that they'll have to take with them when they are doing BG2, so I'm holding out hope that these will be resolved.

Overall I'm still happy with it and I'm going to continue this playthrough before waiting for the eventual mod ports, reacquaint myself with the unmodded game. Its so damn easy now though after being used to the various difficulty enhancers and bullshit Tactics encounters. Also getting used to the BG1 spells instead of the BG2 ones. Bless lasts a very short time, Sleep is massively more powerful, etc.

Edited by Tzarnal, 29 November 2012 - 04:19 AM.


#828 Grunker

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:09 AM

Oh dear lord, what a mess:

My favorite part thus far is that their new non-hardcoded interface, arguably the best idea they had code-wise, is all manner of jacked up right now. The interface itself seems fine, but they basically have made every possible strings/index error across the interface. In a decently large number of cases the interfaces reports on THAC0, AC, Damage, whatever are totally unreliable because it's sourcing the wrong numbers to calculate them. The correct values are being used IN-GAME for actual combat but the interface is just lying to you. One example: 19 Str characters have their THAC0 calculated incorrectly: it reports a +7 to-hit and +7 damage bonus from strength, the damage value is correct but it should only be +3 to-hit: sooo the new age interface sources the erroneous 7 value and reports THAC0 4 better than actuality in every possible area.

Similarly hilarious: rather than expecting us to use our head knowledge of AD&D common sense, they've taken to every item description containing a 100% EXHAUSTIVE, NO STONE UNTURNED list of EVERY possible thing you can be that can't use that item. It even lists redundant kits and multi-class combinations(or both, in the case of all the Gnome Illusionist/X combos, which get their own listing!). For generic items about 50-80% of the description length is the list of stuff that can't use it. Here's the kicker though: they botched the strings somehow with the aforementioned Illusionist stuff, every Illusionist or Gnome Illusionist multi-class is instead listed as Transmuter. So this longsword can't be used by Cleric/Transmuters, Fighter/Transmuters, Thief/Transmuters, Transmuters, Mages, Fighter/Mages, etc.etc. YOU CAN'T POSSIBLY MULTICLASS AS A TRANSMUTER ONLY A HUMAN COULD DUAL CLASS THAT AND IT'D BE BRAINDEAD TO DO SO.

Every item I've found so far has that error in it's description, so there's a table of string values screwed up somewhere, and apparently nobody and Beamdog reads those giant list of can't-uses they put on EVERY ITEM.


"I've heard people complain that the game [the new Prince of Persia] is too easy, which seems odd to me, since I died more times than The Nameless One in a smoothie-maker."

- Yahtzee

#829 Archmage Silver

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 09:19 AM

Hm... it sounds like Beamdog's QA failed. I'll probably hold off from buying this one until it's properly patched has at least decent mod support.

#830 Almateria

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:24 AM

How about we make a separate thread, when we can mock BGEE in peace?

#831 Valamyr

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 09:21 PM

I mean sure there are bugs, but I assume theyll be patched. The real good news here is that it seems all the major mods on my "cant play without" list are either deprecated by BGEE or in active adaptation. By Xmas, if all goes well, I might be able to uninstall my modded BGTutu for good :)

Edited by Valamyr, 29 November 2012 - 09:21 PM.


#832 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 09:30 PM

By Xmas, if all goes well, I might be able to uninstall my modded BGTutu for good :)

Real men don't uninstall, they throw the thing to Recycle bin.

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#833 phordicus

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:29 PM

Linking me to a long post that clearly doesn't answer my simple question isn't civil, either. Can she get a gentle warning, too?

I'm arguing with friends here about whether one of us should get this, but an old question is still cropping up: what -- if any -- engine fixes are exclusive to BGEE?
Druid Kit Enhancements 1.0 (requires Dispel Magic fix, whether ToBEx's or Taimon's)

#834 Valamyr

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:59 PM

By Xmas, if all goes well, I might be able to uninstall my modded BGTutu for good :)

Real men don't uninstall, they throw the thing to Recycle bin.


Real men are welcome to their broken registry entries. I'd rather spend my time frolicking in Gullykin with Imoen than reinstalling Windows ;)

#835 Jarno Mikkola

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:07 PM

I'm arguing with friends here about whether one of us should get this, but an old question is still cropping up: what -- if any -- engine fixes are exclusive to BGEE?

Well, Ascension64 has the scematics on how the new *BGMain.exe* is build... as do a few other modders, that can improve the modability of the EE as a game. Assuming just the fact that they volunteered.

PS: are you people certain the "mage kit" is a result of the actual files or just old habbits using out of date modding tools ?
Say, you use the DLTCEP and look at the items, see that the mage only items are set to be usable by transmuter ... that's the image I got from the above... but the fact might be that the kit.2da list has been changed and to get the above tool to work, you need the .dat(data file) from the original BGII_ToB game, not the BGEE... making it having the possibly of being wrong !
The added kit for example could be set to replace the 0x00004000 in the usability flags...

Real men are welcome to their broken registry entries. I'd rather ...

Hi hih ih. Yeah, you might notice that the reference to the "real men" ... :D
But I can fix my windows registery, thanks to the old BGII ToB breaking it a few times.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 29 November 2012 - 11:17 PM.

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#836 Western Paladin

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 09:22 PM

EDIT: nvm, wrong topic.

Edited by Western Paladin, 01 December 2012 - 12:39 PM.

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#837 Grunker

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 05:22 AM

This is my impression so far after seeing the game and what it has to offer.

What Oster and his team did:

- Port to iPAD. Irrelevant for the PC gamer.
- Port BG1 to the BG2 engine, already done by BGT in a more customizable way.
- Enable higher resolutions, already done by the widescreen mod.
- Upscale graphics to fit the resolution. This failed pretty bad, as BG:EE looks very noticably blurry compared to the original.
- Changed the UI. The added functions do not work, and the functionality of the new GUI is debatable.
- Implemented the mod community's fixes, like BG2 Fixpack.
- Added an Arena-area, which, although it looks like the best of the changes, is at best, mediocre.
- Three new NPCs. The game has 15 underdeveloped ones, and mods add so many even I, who play Baldur's Gate something like once each year, hasn't played all of them. The NPCs are a bit over mod quality, but that's sort of it.
- Changed cinematics. The intro is the best example, where a menacing and terrible Sarevok has become a bad flash cartoon.
- Now, there is the subject of the supposed engine-changes that should make modders able to do stuff that was hard-coded before. I just don't see it. It doesn't look like the engine has had any sort of radical change. TobEx seems advanced compared to this. However, it's the only point where I can't draw strong conclusions, so this might actually be BG:EE's only redeeming feature.

Now, you might disagree with me that the new intro movies are bad, but I gotta ask: Was any of the above necessary? Can any of the above be said to enhance the original to a point where it's worth 20$? They didn't have the time, talent or money to actually change the game in meaningful ways, so they ended up changing some cinematics and the UI. Stuff that was always fine, stuff this very forum has praised as some of the best in the industry. This project is, at best, superfluous.

Now, on to what they didn't do:

- Fix the pathfinding
- Balance the kits inherited from BG2. It's incredibly unprofessional how this has that rough "mod"-feeling. Kensei and Monk are still useless on lower levels, while other kits are too good and obviously not intented for BG1.
- Fleshed out NPCs already there. They could have at least done something with BG1NPC, I mean, they haven't felt above just using the work of modders before.
- Add content to some of the more empty wilderness areas.
- Improve the sprites.
- Change or update anything of real significance, apart from the possible engine or .exe changes.

All in all I simply cannot fathom how the dedicated fans of this site can praise Oster for this work. The only argument I have some amount of sympathy with is that BG:EE might cause a resurgence of interest in this type of game (as if Project Eternity hadn't already), or that modders might start working on some new projects that will revitalize the scene. These arguments are problematic for two reasons: Firstly, Project Eternity has already and will probably give this type of game more of a kick than an iPAD version of BG ever could. Secondly, the pay-off of a modder revitalization - if such a thing will indeed occur - won't pay off until many years down the line, and it damned sure isn't a reason to actually purchase BG:EE currently.

All in all, this community should be critical of BG:EE. It was a fantastic chance to do something with the IP that passed us by.

Edited by Grunker, 01 December 2012 - 05:46 AM.

"I've heard people complain that the game [the new Prince of Persia] is too easy, which seems odd to me, since I died more times than The Nameless One in a smoothie-maker."

- Yahtzee

#838 Almateria

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 05:28 AM

- Port to iPAD. Irrelevant for the PC gamer.

See it's funnhy because even if he did port it to iPad, all those bugs have caused the port to fail Apple's quality control and it's stuck in the waiting room again. Meanwhile, Oster doesn't talk about it at all and the site still promises a release in November.

#839 Grunker

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 05:48 AM

- Port to iPAD. Irrelevant for the PC gamer.

See it's funnhy because even if he did port it to iPad, all those bugs have caused the port to fail Apple's quality control and it's stuck in the waiting room again. Meanwhile, Oster doesn't talk about it at all and the site still promises a release in November.


I actually didn't know this was the hold-up, since I really don't give a toss about the port. Interesting and tragically hilarious.

Edited by Grunker, 01 December 2012 - 05:51 AM.

"I've heard people complain that the game [the new Prince of Persia] is too easy, which seems odd to me, since I died more times than The Nameless One in a smoothie-maker."

- Yahtzee

#840 -devIceMan-

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 06:14 AM

Grunker, spot on, what can I say. I'm utterly disappointed by the new "Enhanced Edition", which is anything but enhanced. I'm sticking to the old BG, for now, for many years to come. Maybe at some point after years and years have gone by, we'll have a genuine Enhanced Edition of the game, but at the moment the BeamDog variant doesn't look like it.