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Discussion of v3.11 [ARCHIVED]


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#1 aVENGER

aVENGER
  • Modder
  • 1680 posts

Posted 31 October 2003 - 04:19 AM

======================
= Changes from versions 2.xx =
======================


Rogue ReBalancing (core)
-------------------------------
  • Mod split up into several separately installable components
  • Bard HLAs revised to resemble 3.5E D&D abilities
  • New Lingering Song HLA added for Bards
  • New Crippling Strike HLA added for Thieves
  • Evasion and Greater Evasion have been merged into a single ability
  • Blade kit now receives (regular) Whirlwind and Crippling Strike instead of Enhanced song/Lingering song
  • Revised all Bard songs so that the same songs no longer stack. Also, fixed range of the regular songs, it's no longer infinite
  • Tweaked the Weapons Display Blade ability; it now streamlines better with levels
  • The tooltip description for the Summon Spirit Warrior ability of the Bard's Magic Flute now displays appropriate text
  • Marina's portrait altered and her dialogue was slightly expanded
Thief Kit Changes

Note: only the latest alterations are listed here, for a more detailed list consult the mod readme file.

Bounty Hunter

The Bounty Hunter's special snares have been completely revised. They no longer have the maze/sphere effects and their physical damage component (which was strangely missing from level 16 and higher) has been restored. The new secondary effects of the snares are primarily used for disabling and incapacitating foes and they vary according to level. They last for three rounds and can always be avoided by a successful save:

1st: deals 4d6 damage and slows the target (save vs. spells to avoid)
11th: deals 6d6 damage and entangles the target (save vs. spells at -1 to avoid)
16th: deals 8d6 damage and blinds the target (save vs. spells at -2 to avoid)
21th: deals 10d6 damage and knocks the target unconscious (save vs. spells at -2 to avoid)


The Bounty Hunter now also gets a new 'Tranquilizing Shot' special ability once for every eight experience levels. It works similarly to the Assassin's 'Poison Weapon' ability, but instead of poisoning the weapon this ability coats it in a tranquilizing substance which can knock out victims unless they make their saves. The 'coating' effect lasts for 18 seconds and the unconsciousness lasts for one round. Note: It is not possible to repeatedly tranquilize a creature until the first effect wears off. Also, neither Tranquilizing Shot nor the secondary effects from the traps affect creatures with more than 20 Hit Dice (levels). Upon reaching level 23 Bounty Hunters may now pick the 'Tracking' HLA as well.


Crippling Strike HLA

A new high level ability called Crippling Strike is now available to all Thieves of level 24 and above. The Blade bard kit also gains this ability.

Requires: Greater Evasion
An experienced Rogue can use the knowledge of his opponents' weak spots to gain an advantage in combat. For three rounds after this ability is activated, every attack of the Rogue deals a devastating blow that weakens an enemy. On each successful hit the Strength score of the victim is lowered to 10 (save vs. death at -2 to avoid) for three rounds. There is also a chance that the target will either become Blinded (15%), Slowed (15%) or suffer a cumulative 1 point THAC0 penalty (30%). These secondary effects last for two rounds, and the opponent may attempt a save vs. breath with a -4 penalty to avoid them completely.

Note: This is a supernatural ability, therefore it completely ignores any magic resistance of the subject creatures, however specific effect immunities still apply. Also, the ability does not affect creatures with more than 20 Hit Dice (levels).




Bard Kit Changes

Bards no longer get 'Set X Trap' high level abilities. Instead, Bards now gain three new HLAs which are similar to spells in their working ways, but due to their supernatural status ignore any magic resistance. Another new HLA called 'Lingering Song' has been added and the 'Magic Flute' HLA has been improved as well.


Mass Charm

Range: Visual range of the caster
Duration: 5 rounds
Casting Time: 6
Area of Effect: 30 feet radius
Saving Throw: Special

By focusing his willpower the Bard influences the actions nearby creatures by suggesting a course of activity. The suggestion must be worded in such a manner as to make the activity sound reasonable. Obviously self-destructive orders are not carried out and break the enchantment. If a common language is shared, the Bard can generally force the subjects to perform as he desires, within the limits of their abilities. If no common language is shared, the character can communicate only by using basic commands, such as "Come here," "Go there," "Fight," "Stand still" etc. The creatures can attempt a saving throw vs. spells in order to avoid being controlled, but even if they succeed, there is still a 50% chance that they will suffer a mental breakdown. This will effectively cause them to enter a Berserk state (no save) and attack the nearest creature for one round.

Note: This is a supernatural ability, therefore it completely ignores any magic resistance of the subject creatures. Specific effect immunities (like the Elven innate Charm resistance) still apply while Undead, Constructs and Demonic creatures are completely unaffected by this ability. Also, the ability does not affect creatures with more than 20 Hit Dice (levels). Anyone who successfully resists or frees himself from the Bard's control is much less suspectable to fall for it again, at least for a while.


Enthralling Melody

Range: Visual range of the caster
Duration: 5 rounds
Casting Time: 7
Area of Effect: 30 feet radius
Saving Throw: Special

While the Bard softly hums this catchy tune, he can amaze and enthrall any audience, even those that do not understand his language. Listeners in the area of effect must successfully save vs. paralyzation or give the Bard their undivided attention, totally ignoring their surroundings. Even enemies become stunned in amazement for 5 rounds if they fail their save. In addition, even if the saving throw is made there is still a 50% chance that opponents will become so deeply immersed into the hypnotic song that they effectively become stricken with Feeblemindness (no save) for 1 round.

Note: This is a supernatural ability, therefore it completely ignores any magic resistance of the subject creatures. Specific effect immunities still apply while Undead, Constructs and Demonic creatures are completely unaffected by this ability. Also, the ability does not affect creatures with more than 20 Hit Dice (levels). Anyone who successfully resists or frees himself from the enthralling effect is much less suspectable to fall for it again, at least for a while.


Sound Burst

Range: Visual range of the caster
Duration: Instantaneous
Casting Time: 5
Area of Effect: 30 feet radius
Saving Throw: Special

The Bard magically amplifies the capabilities of a musical instrument in order to fill his surroundings with high pitched, stone shattering Sound Waves. Creatures in the nearby area take 15d6 points of magic damage and are also deafened for 3 rounds. (A deafened creature has an effective 50% chance of spellcasting failure.) A successful save vs. breath halves the damage and negates the deafness.

Note: This is a supernatural ability, therefore it completely ignores any magic resistance of the subject creatures. Specific immunity to magical damage still applies. Also, the deafness caused by this ability does not affect creatures with more than 20 Hit Dice (levels).


Lingering Song

Once a Bard's musical talents have reached a significant level, his music can stay with the listeners long after the last note has died away. After the Bard stops playing, the effects of his or her song last an additional 2 rounds.
Requires: Enhanced Bard Song




Chosen of Cyric Encounter
----------------------------------
  • Full scale dialogue added with three main and multiple interlinking paths that allow peaceful solutions
  • Several new cutscenes and weather effects added
  • Battle and area music added
  • AI scripts tweaked
  • Replaced the Dark Mystery with Venduris' Luckstone
  • Stun graphics added for Stormcharged Axe
  • The HoldFast sword now actually casts Hold Person as a spell, therefore, it can now affect multiple opponents.
  • The Non-Detection granted by the Salamander's Tongue is no longer dispellable
New items that can be acquired through my mods
-------------------------------------------------------------

Rogue's Ward +2


This buckler shows traces of an enchantment often used by clerics of Mask. The Shadowlord blessed this shield with his touch to hide and guard those who follow him from any dangers which they might encounter in their risky professions. Therefore, the owner of this buckler can evade death magics more easily and even gains a slight resistance to all other spells. The surface of the shield is dark and very smooth. It can reflect the image of its wielder to fool enemies in times of need.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 3
Save vs. Death: +4 bonus
Magic Resistance: +2%
Casts Mislead once per day
Special: No Missile/Piercing Attack Protection
Weight: 2
Requires: 4 Strength
Only Usable By:
Thief
Bard


The Guardian +2

This odd shield seams to be entirely made up of large hardened leaves. The unusual shape and size of these leaves suggests they came from ancient oak trees which grow deep in the Forest of Mir. Upon closer examination powerful druidic enchantments can be discovered emanating from the shield's surface and it seams to slightly increase the health of its owner while held. Every morning, at sunrise, one of the leaves glows faintly for a moment. It can then be picked and planted into the ground while another instantly grows back to take its place. After the proper incantation is spoken, the planted leaf will grow into a fearsome Shambling Mound who's strength depends on the skill of the Druid. Because of its unique origin, the power of this shield can only be unlocked by the most devoted of Nature's followers.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 3
Hit Point Max: +5
Summon Shambling Mound once per day
Special: No Missile/Piercing Attack Protection
Weight: 1
Requires: 4 Strength
Only Usable By:
Druids


Lyre of Progression

The Lyre of Progression was created by the bard Sedini Paletto. Sedini was a teacher of young aspiring bards during difficult times. This instrument, held close at all times, helped Sedini fight off those who would attack him or his students. When Sedini grew old, he passed it on to his best student, Galwen Alaman. Galwen continued teaching for a few years before setting out into the wilderness on a life of adventure. It is believed that he lost the lyre when he accidentally dropped it in a marsh.

STATISTICS:

Held under the left arm, this instrument allows a bard to memorize two extra second level spells and an extra third level spell.

Only Usable By:
Bards



Returning Frost Dart

The origins of this weapon are rooted to the snow cowered plains of Icewind Dale. It is told that a priestess of Auril created the darts for the purpose of always having a last resort weapon at hand. A dart seamed perfect for the task since it's small and easily concealable. Therefore, this weapon can rarely be sighted away from the Auril worshipper circle. Recently however, merchants of the Ten Towns region have been acquiring suspiciously large quantities of these darts from local adventuring parties.

Judging by it's shape, color and size this weapon could easily be mistaken for a small icicle. It actually feels a bit chilly in your hand, and you notice that fine lines of power have been carefully scribed into the shaft of the weapon.

STATISTICS:

THAC0: +1 bonus
Damage: 1D3 +1
Damage type: missile (piercing)
Special:
Frost: 25% chance +1d6 cold damage
Returning: Returns to user
Weight: 0
Speed Factor: 1
Proficiency Type: Dart
Type: 1-handed
Not Usable By:
Cleric


The (improved) Short Sword of Backstabbing

The Shadow's Blade was created to be the perfect assassin's tool. It is highly sought after by any who settle differences with a blade, and many that possess it do not do so for long. In the hands of any character this sword acts as a standard +3 magical weapon, but in the hands of a Thief it becomes especially potent granting him an additional bonus to hit and increasing his backstab multiplier.

STATISTICS:

THAC0: +3 bonus (+5 for Thieves)
Damage: 1D6 +3
Damage type piercing
Special: Increases backstab multiplier by one (Thieves only)
Weight: 3
Speed Factor: 0
Proficiency Type: Short Sword
Type: 1-handed
Requires: 5 Strength
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage




Barrier Amulet


This powerful amulet was crafted by the enchanter Celemon of Calimport in 727 DR. He crafted ten such amulets on commission before jealous rivals killed him and attempted to duplicate the procedure. His colleagues were not as talented as Celemon, and destroyed their laboratory and themselves when a mishap occurred. The formula was destroyed as well. This particular amulet was owned by the elven warrior-mage Pelan Rainwind. It was lost when he was killed by giants in the Spine of the World somewhere around 840 DR.

STATISTICS:

Simultaneously casts Stoneskin and Minor Globe of Invulnerability on the user 3x per day.
Usable By:
Mage
Sorcerer



Boots of the Fox


These gaudy red and green boots were worn by the rogue Elpham of Perrywine. Elpham was a pickpocket of exceptional talent who pressed his luck by taunting his victims shortly after taking their loot. After being caught twice, Elpham invested his money in having these boots made. Of course, Elpham came to an untimely end when he picked the pocket of the notoriously ill-tempered Red Wizard of Thay, Xain Morobdel. Elpham stole a pouch full of gems off of Xain's waist and danced off into the crowd shouting, "Why don't you try to chase me back to the Priador, baldy? Ha ha!" Xain, quietly fuming, promptly summoned four invisible stalkers and commanded them to, "Kill the idiot in the red and green boots."

STATISTICS:

+1 Bonus to Armor Class
Increases movement rate by 40%



Stormcharged Axe

This superbly crafted axe holds an enchantment of unusual origin. Immediately after it was forged the axe was brought on top of a high mountain peak where dwarven priests waited for a great storm to gather. The weapon was placed on an iron pedestal and soon afterward struck by a bolt of lightning. Because of the pre placed enchantment it absorbed some of the bolt's properties.

The axe was later given to a high ranking dwarven captain to aid him in the ensuing battle between the orcish hordes and the dwarves of Dorn's Deep. The attack came as a complete surprise to the dwarwes when one morning a scout arrived and told that the largest orcish army he had ever seen was only hours away. With little time to prepare, the dwarven warriors were overrun and the orcs began to pour into Dorn's Deep. The dwarves were forced to retreat into the depths of the citadel but key passages were collapsed to cover their movements and buy them time. Even in such dire conditions, this allowed the dwarves to control when and where they would fight. Every battle cost the orcs dearly as the dwarves fought on their terms, but they were still being driven farther and farther back into Wyrm's Tooth Glacier. Eventually, due to their superior numbers, the orcs managed to breach the dwarven defenses and plunder their homes.

STATISTICS:
Damage: 1D8+3
THAC0: +3
Damage type: Slashing
Special:
+1d4 electrical damage
15% chance target is Stunned
Weight: 5
Speed Factor: 4
Proficiency Type: Axe
Type: 1-handed
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage
Thief



Hold Fast

A Zhentarim battle mage crafted this blade hoping it would help him prevail in melee combat when he was challenged to a duel. The powerful sword was supposed to deflect most incoming blows and incapacitate his enemy at the same time. Unfortunately, the mage lacked any real skill with the weapon and was easily defeated by his opponent.

STATISTICS:

Damage: 1D8 +3
THAC0: +3 bonus
Damage type: Slashing
Armor Class: +1 bonus
Special:
15% chance of casting Hold Person
+15% Slashing Resistance
Weight: 4
Speed Factor: 4
Proficiency Type: Long Sword
Type: 1-handed
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage



Studded Leather of Resistance +3

This peculiar piece of leather is rumored to have come from Sigil. Not much is known of it's previous owners but the leather seams to have been cut from the hide of some lesser Tanar'ri. Those that have worn the armor were bestowed with slight damage and elemental resistances. It is unclear if these powers come from the hide itself or enchantments placed upon it.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class: 4
Resistance Bonuses:
+15% Piercing Resistance
+15% Slashing Resistance
+15% Fire Resistance
+15% Electrical Resistance
+2 Save vs. Spells
Weight: 15
Not Usable By:
Mage



Spell Diver

The spellsword Naradon of Thesk was known for his ability to quickly and efficiently defeat enemy mages even when outnumbered. He earned this reputation with the help of three items: Potions of Speed, Boots of Speed, and his trusted short sword, Spell Diver. Unlike many other magical weapons, Spell Diver does not have a dark, murderous history. Naradon retired from adventuring when he was thirty-two. His fondness for Potions of Speed caught up with him when he died of old age four years later. His only heir had no desires to be an adventurer. He sold the weapon to a known cat burglar a few years after his father's death. The sword can be recognized by the kingfisher stamped into the ricasso.

STATISTICS:

Damage: 1D6+2
THAC0: +2
Damage type: Piercing
Special: 25% of all hits nullify the target's ability cast spells for 2 rounds
Resistance Bonuses:
+1 to Save vs. Spells
+5% Magic Resistance
Weight: 1
Speed Factor: 1
Proficiency Type: Short Sword
Type: 1-handed
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage



Rogue's Cowl

This dark brown cowl is meant to be worn on the head and over the shoulders as a broad hood. It was crafted by the gnomish thief and illusionist Brein Chestnut. Brein used the cowl on his own adventures for several years before his childhood sweetheart convinced him to settle down. He gave the cowl to his nephew, Chirchet, who in turn sold the item for a large stretch of farmland.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: +1
Special: +15% to Hide In Shadows
Wearer can cast Blindness and Prismatic Spray 1/Day.
Weight: 2
Only Usable By:
Thief
Bard



Silent Death

This sword once belonged to Venduris, a cunning assassin in service of the Prince of Lies. When the rogue was initially accepted into the order of Cyric's Chosen he received a small, plain looking blade as a welcoming gift. Though the sword held only minor enchantments back then, its power seemed to grow with each kill Venduris made in the name of his new master. The assassin preferred to fulfill these tasks swiftly and silently, and often his victims were not even aware of their nearing demise. Sometimes though, when a foe had angered his patron significantly, Venduris would apply a deadly venom to his blade before striking. The victim would then start choking, rendered unable to speak or cry for help, while Cyric laughed in glee as the mute face of his target twisted from the pain and agony caused by the later poison effects which eventually led to a slow, tormenting death.

The blade pulsates with a dim greenish glow and clearly radiates evil emanations. The tip and edges of the sword are coated with a layer of magical poison, making it very difficult to use the weapon without harming oneself. Only rogues of exceptional skill and cunning may attempt to wield this blade.

STATISTICS:

THACO: +4 bonus
Damage: 1D6 +4
Damage type: piercing
On Each Hit:
6 points of poison damage (1 per second)
Save vs. Breath or become Silenced
5% chance of casting Finger of Death
Weight: 1
Speed Factor: 0
Proficiency Type: Short Sword
Type: 1-handed
Requires: 15 Dexterity and Intelligence
Not usable By:
Anyone but Thieves
Good Characters



Shadowed Boots


Upon closer inspection of these boots, the fabric seems to be made of some odd, incorporeal material. Wearing these boots causes the user to take on an almost shadowed or ghostly appearance. Additionally, sound becomes eerily muffled as if heard from a distance.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 1
Special:
+10% Move Silently
+15% Hide In Shadows
Weight: 5
Only usable by:
Thief



The Salamander's Tongue


A wicked-looking dagger with a dark history, the Salamander's Tongue is prized both for its use as a weapon and its hidden magical powers. The blade appears to be an exotic looking dagger with a kris-like wavy blade ending in two small points. A small portion of a slimy, bright red living salamander's tongue is somehow embedded in the heart of the blade, near the grip. It pulses and writhes randomly without intervention from the owner.

The exact origins of the blade are unknown, but it is believed that the first owner of the weapon was a respected and feared gnomish thief and assassin from Westgate named Turlam Shallowhill. Turlam was killed in a fight with a rival, a halfling called Deder Seven Fingers. Deder kept the weapon as a trophy, not knowing its powers until after it was stolen by an underling, a fellow halfling named Kreshinal Blackhound. Kreshinal fled to Selgaunt with the dagger for five years, relying on its powers to hide him from divination. Kreshinal lost the dagger in a botched gambling scam, and was killed by Deder's agents within the month. Deder attempted to reclaim the dagger from the Sembian criminals who had captured it. He succeeded at routing the thieves and reclaiming his dagger, but he focused so much attention on the blade that he didn't notice that the Sembian criminals had employed a priest of Mask to infiltrate and break down his interests in Westgate. The ensuing war between the Westgate and Selgaunt factions ended when the priest of Mask, Pieter the Feeble, made the two sides so paranoid that they ate themselves away from the inside. Pieter grabbed the dagger when he had the opportunity and escaped to Hillsfar, confident that the unorganized demihuman supporters of the late Deder Seven Fingers wouldn't follow him to a place so hostile to their kind.

In yet another scam, Pieter sold the blade to a Mulmaster Hawk while luring other potential buyers to an auction in Hillsfar. Pieter and his associates murdered the buyers at the fake auction and made off with the cash, hiding under the cover of an Amulet of Non-Detection. The Mulmaster Hawk who purchased the blade was supposedly killed by priestesses of Umberlee who were angry at the assassin's refusal to pay tribute to the Bitch Queen. Years of factional fighting between the Umberlants are believed to have transported the blade as much as three thousand miles away from its humble beginnings in Sembia. The whereabouts of Pieter the Feeble and his goons are currently unknown.

Damage: 1D4 +3
THAC0: +3 bonus
Damage type: Piercing
Resistance Bonuses:
+10% Fire Resistance
+3 Save vs. Poison
Special:
20% of all hits do +1D4 fire damage
User under the effects of Non-Detection
Weight: 1
Speed Factor: 0
Proficiency Type: Daggers
Type: 1-handed
Not Usable By:
Cleric



Dead Man's Face


These ancient helms were once common among the Reghedmen barbarians who came to what is now known as Icewind Dale. The design of the armor is relatively simple: a plain iron helm with a hinged faceplate. Once the basic construction of the helm had been finished, craftsmen would tool the image of a dead warrior onto the faceplate. The name of the warrior and a one word description of his death were carved into the forehead of the mask. The helm was then left in the dead warrior's funeral pyre. The priests believed that the mask would hide the dead man's fear of the afterlife when he was judged by Tempos. After a month had passed, the helms of particularly valiant warriors were recovered by the priests. Over the next few years, the priests praised the valiant warriors by name in their daily rituals. According to legend, if Tempos found the warrior to be truly valiant, the helm would gain the power to make the wearer immune to fear. This particular helm bears the ancient name "Siglef" and the word "Axe".

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 1
Special:
Protects Against Critical Hits
Wearer is immune to Fear
-2 Charisma while worn
Weight: 3
Not Usable By:
Mage
Bard
Thief



Sune's Laurel of Favor


This wreath of laurel leaves and roses was a gift from the church of Sune to the priestesses of Hanali Celanil at the Hand of the Seldarine. The representatives of the human goddess of love and beauty were well received and the high priestess of Hanali Celanil wore the laurel whenever humans were visiting the Hand. The orcs discarded the laurel as useless trash when they sacked the priests' tower.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 1
Special: +1 Charisma while worn
Weight: 1
Not Usable By:
Evil Characters


Venduris' Luckstone

Stolen during a raid of Cyric's agents against the Dryads of Stormshire, this Ioun Stone has malcontently served the assassin Venduris ever since. The essence of luck contained within the gem was abused by the atrocious rogue for guiding his already skilled hands towards the weakest spots of his foes, nearly always ensuring the maximum lethality of the attacks. Once beautiful to behold, resembling a sparkling rainbow patterned jewel, the Luckstone eventually became corrupted under the influence of its new owner. The darkness which now resides within it stands as a reminder of Venduris' vile deeds.

STATISTICS:

Requires: 15 Intelligence
+3 bonus to THAC0
+3 bonus to Luck

Only Usable By:
Evil or Neutral Characters
Thief
Mage
Bard



Venduris' Ring of Concealment

This ring was originally taken from an over ambitious Thayvian Illusionist who somehow managed to cross Cyric's plans. When Venduris was sent to remove this mage he also picked up an invisibility ring from his personal treasury. The assassin rarely felt the need to employ it as he was highly skilled in the art of stealth, but the ring proved useful on a few rare occasions when he had to capture his victims alive and drag them back to his master's temples for interrogation or torture without being exposed to magical detection.

STATISTICS:

Wearer is Non-Detectable by magical means such as Detect Invisibility, True Seeing and Scrying.
Casts Mass Invisibility once per day

Only Usable By:
Thief
Mage
Bard


Note: Most of these items are acquired from the Chosen of Cyric Encounter but a few can be bought from my rogue shop and some are acquired through normal gameplay.

Edited by aVENGER, 04 June 2007 - 02:49 AM.


#2 T.G.Maestro

T.G.Maestro

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Posted 31 October 2003 - 04:35 AM

Version 3.00 downloaded and installed ;)
I'm in a rush right now, so I'll post comments a bit later!
Posted Image

Refinements v2 has been released!
Go and visit the website or the forum for more info!

Member of The Silver Star team.

#3 aVENGER

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Posted 31 October 2003 - 04:42 AM

Glad to hear that T.G! :)

Be sure to check out the new and Chosen of Cyric encounter + Dialogue! Since you were the most active tester in its BETA, phase I'd really like to hear your opinion on the final revision. B)

#4 T.G.Maestro

T.G.Maestro

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Posted 31 October 2003 - 06:17 AM

Well then, lets see the details:

Thief HLAs:

- Bounty Hunter changes: perfect. (But that 16th level BH trap still lacks some slow effect ;) );
- Crippling Strike: good. My only problem is that 10 points of STR. Since this ability SETS STR to 10, it can increase STR if the target has less than 10 points in it. Instead of setting STR to a specific value I would advise to lower STR and DEX by 3 points each (non cumulative);

Bard HLAs:

- Mass Charm and Enthralling Melody are both fine, their secondary negative effects (berserk and feeblemindedness) could last a bit longer - around 10 seconds. 1 round is just too short: creatures will not even reach their target in berserk state.
- Sound Burst and Lingering Song are perfect. (What icon did you pick for SB? I would advise changing the Wail of the Banshee icon, it is very fitting IMHO)

All the other changes for the Cyric-encounter seem fine, but I'll say more after a testplay.

By the way, as per our agreement, I hereby announce that I have "stolen" your HLA table for bards and the Crippling Strike ability for further changes ;) :D .
Posted Image

Refinements v2 has been released!
Go and visit the website or the forum for more info!

Member of The Silver Star team.

#5 aVENGER

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Posted 31 October 2003 - 10:42 AM

Bounty Hunter changes: perfect. (But that 16th level BH trap still lacks some slow effect


I really didn't feel the need for an additional effect... Blindness seamed quite enough, as most monsters stop reacting to opponents out of their melee range once they are blinded. Besides, all other levels have just one secondary effect, it would kind of stand out...

Crippling Strike: good. My only problem is that 10 points of STR. Since this ability SETS STR to 10, it can increase STR if the target has less than 10 points in it.


Hmm, this isn't really an issue IMO, as most monsters with a STR score below 10 can be easily disposed of anyway. This ability is primarily intended for crippling the high level fighter types like Fire Giants and such.

Instead of setting STR to a specific value I would advise to lower STR and DEX by 3 points each (non cumulative)


Were this an normal spell, I would consider it (since it would be easy to implement standard immunity after the initial effect hits) but alas, I had to use EFFs again because of its 'coating' nature and applying a STR immunity would be very.. .cumbersome and might even cause some other problems *hates using coating effects with a passion* <_<

Mass Charm and Enthralling Melody are both fine, their secondary negative effects (berserk and feeblemindedness) could last a bit longer - around 10 seconds. 1 round is just too short: creatures will not even reach their target in berserk stat


Good point, though I think it's actually at 7 seconds right now, but I will consider upping it to 10 sec nonetheless.

hat icon did you pick for SB? I would advise changing the Wail of the Banshee icon


Actually, I think I'm already using that icon :D

All the other changes for the Cyric-encounter seem fine, but I'll say more after a testplay.


How did the new cutscenes and the new "CYTEST" console command work? In theory, it should allow very quick testing of the CoC encounter from anywhere in the game. You should even be able to return to your originating place after testing the encounter? Also, I've revised some items and added the descriptions to the first post ^ BTW, what do you think of the new CoC dialogue and cutscenes ?

By the way, as per our agreement, I hereby announce that I have "stolen" your HLA table for bards and the Crippling Strike ability for further changes


Heh, no problem, but I'm sure Littiz will have more fun deciphering my messy .Tp2 :lol: :P Anyway, if you need some help with any of the files, just drop me a line!

#6 Littiz

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 01:12 AM

Fine load of stuff aVENGER!!!!
Next days I'll have a closer look to your work :)
I hope you will want to do yet another little revision of your mod, coordinating with us! I think it'll be worth it!

Heh, no problem, but I'm sure Littiz will have more fun deciphering my messy .Tp2 :lol: :P  Anyway, if you need some help with any of the files, just drop me a line!

...while I hope you won't ask explanations about the code for Use Scrolls, as I don't understand it myself anymore :lol:
Ever forward, my darling wind...

#7 aVENGER

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 06:06 AM

Fine load of stuff aVENGER!!!!
Next days I'll have a closer look to your work
I hope you will want to do yet another little revision of your mod, coordinating with us! I think it'll be worth it!

I'll probably publish a few small bugfix/balance updates in the next few weeks, as I always do when I make a major mod revision, but, in general this is most likely the end of my BG2 modding career. I might be willing to add your 'Use Scrolls' ability but that's really all there is to it.

BG2 modding was fun most of the time, and I've learned a lot of useful things in the process, but it is simply time to move on... B)



...while I hope you won't ask explanations about the code for Use Scrolls, as I don't understand it myself anymore


Heh, trust me, I know that feeling :D :P

#8 Assassin

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 09:42 AM

The Crippling Strike ability, in passing, seems to be to me overpowered, at least the Blind and Slow part of it. 50% is a lot; people are already complaining about the Flail of Ages + 5, and that has 33% chance to slow. Imagine a Rogue/Fighter with that skill. He could blind the entire field with an area-effect weapon, then proceed to slaughter the whole place.

I would say make it only available to melee weapons (if it can be done), and make it a 50/50 of either Slow or Blind, both at a save of -2 to -4.

#9 aVENGER

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 10:06 AM

I think that my in-game description might be a bit unclear. <_< You see, the Crippling Strike HLA actually has a 50% chance of either Blinding or Slowing the target.

So, in reality, this gives you a 25% chance of Slowing the target, a 25% chance of Blinding it (these two are mutually exclusive) and a 50% chance of doing nothing at all. Also, this ability lasts for 3 rounds, while the effect on the FoA is active as long as the flail remains equipped, so I don't think it's really that unbalancing.

BTW, what area effect weapons are you reffering to?

#10 T.G.Maestro

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 10:12 AM

Anyway, Cripple would do well without that "maximum damage/hit" effect. There is a damage maximizing/enhancing ability (Assassination) already, no need to add more damage increasing feats. Not to mention that Cripple was not intended to KILL things but to literally cripple them - and that is slightly different. That ability would be used for disabling opponents or significantly weaken them, but not for killing at all. So instead of giving it max. damage/hit, I would suggest to actually LOWER damage/hit by 3-5 points.
Anyway, some balancing on this one is needed.
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#11 aVENGER

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 10:41 AM

The maximum damage effect is supposed to portray the insight that the rogue uses to make a truly devastating blow which cripples his opponent. Without it, the ability looks kind of... empty.

Also, don't forget that Crippling Strike is a ToB HLA, and that monsters which you face at that stage have ridiculous THAC0 values (they almost never miss) so granting a slight penalty to hit would be rather pointless IMO.

#12 T.G.Maestro

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 10:56 AM

The maximum damage effect is supposed to portray the insight that the rogue uses to make a truly devastating blow

As I've stated before there is already an ability for that one (Assassination). No need for another. Plus, to make such an attack, a thief must concentrate to target nerve-spots and other special areas on the targets body, but definetly not vital spots (as A. does). This HLA shouldn't be about killing, its about crippling - just as the name suggests ;) .

Also, don't forget that Crippling Strike a ToB HLA

And? Note that Evasion, +6th level Mage Spell, War Cry, and some other virtually useless abilities are also HLAs. Compared to them, Crippling Strike is a powerhouse. My suggestion would be:

-3 to damage on each hit;
-reduce targets STR to 10 for 3 rounds (save vs. death at -4);
-25-25% chance of blinding/slowing victim for 6 rounds (save vs. breath at -2)
lasts 3 rounds

or if you would keep that max. damage:
-max. damage on each successful hit;
-3 Attack Roll penalty (the thief must concemtrate on targeting those spots on the opponent);
-reduce targets STR to 10 for 3 rounds (save vs. death at -4);
-25-25% chance of blinding/slowing victim for 6 rounds (save vs. breath at -2)
lasts 3 rounds
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#13 aVENGER

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 11:15 AM

As I've stated before there is already an ability for that one (Assassination). No need for another


Assassination works quite differently, namely it turns every one of your hits within the following round into a backstab. This alone gives you a potential of dealing 50-300 points of damage in that round.

Crippling Strike merely allows your weapon to deal its maximum damage dice during the next 3 rounds (i.e. if the normal damage potential is 1d8 then with CS it will always be 8). This is similar to the Kensai's 'Kai' ability (which lasts for 10 seconds) and the level 5 Priest spell 'Righteous Magic' which lasts for 1/round per level.

Note that Evasion, +6th level Mage Spell, War Cry, and some other virtually useless abilities are also HLAs.


Those were Bioware's choices and their design decisions. I would have done it differently.

My suggestion would be:

[...]
-reduce targets STR to 10 for 3 rounds (save vs. death at -4)
[...]


I may consider this part, though I'd make the penalty just -2.

#14 Caedwyr

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 01:15 PM

A small typo in one of the item descriptions:

Shadowed Boots


Upon closer inspection of these boots, the fabric seems to be made of some corporeal material. Wearing these boots causes the user to take on an almost shadowed or ghostly appearance. Additionally, sound becomes eerily muffled as if heard from a distance.

STATISTICS:

Armor Class Bonus: 1
Special:
+10% Move Silently
+15% Hide In Shadows
Weight: 5
Only usable by:
Thief


The word should be incorporeal since corporeal means to have a body or substance, which is the norm for most objects. Ghosts are incorpreal (without body.)

You've done a good job on most of the items, creating useful but not overpowered items.
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#15 aVENGER

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 06:34 PM

Heh, that would actually be BIS' mistake then, as I took the description directly from IWD1. :P

I we fixed it though, as it really didn't make much sense in that context. Thanks!

#16 T.G.Maestro

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Posted 03 November 2003 - 01:36 AM

Crippling Strike merely allows your weapon to deal its maximum damage dice during the next 3 rounds (i.e. if the normal damage potential is 1d8 then with CS it will always be 8). This is similar to the Kensai's 'Kai' ability

Yep, thats exactly what I kepp talking about: Kensais use this ability to KILL opponents very fast and efficiently, while thieves use Assassination for the same purpose. The main point of these abilities is to destroy an opponent in a few hits (while the thief version does far more damage it is well balanced with the lower THAC0). Again, Criplle is not for killing (nor was it in 3rd E, for example IWD2) it aims to weaken the opponent and make it easy to kill (by using abilities like Assassination).
Note, that thieves do not target the most painful spots on an opponent (making their weapon to deal full damage), but some more sensitive points in order to "CRIPPLE" them...

Those were Bioware's choices and their design decisions. I would have done it differently

But since this is STILL BG2 made by Bioware and not a game of our making (no matter how we mod it!) I would advise to stay synchronized with those choices.

I may consider this part, though I'd make the penalty just -2.

Sounds good for me ;) .
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#17 aVENGER

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Posted 03 November 2003 - 09:38 AM

Again, Criplle is not for killing (nor was it in 3rd E, for example IWD2) it aims to weaken the opponent and make it easy to kill (by using abilities like Assassination).


You seam to forget that, in 3E D&D, CS is only activated on a successful Sneak Attack, which indeed deals some extra damage.

But since this is STILL BG2 made by Bioware and not a game of our making (no matter how we mod it!) I would advise to stay synchronized with those choices.


Not when I consider them to be flawed, and in this instance I most definitively do.

#18 T.G.Maestro

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Posted 03 November 2003 - 11:06 PM

You seam to forget that, in 3E D&D, CS is only activated on a successful Sneak Attack, which indeed deals some extra damage

Right, and sneak attacks require special targeting, which Cripple obviously lack. Something is needed to point out the nature of this ability. By using Cripple the thief won't gain any super-powers, or anything like that - he will simply try to target specific areas on an opponent, but that won't go without some downsides. A small penalty to THAC0 or damage is valid IMHO. But the choice is yours, as always.

Not when I consider them to be flawed, and in this instance I most definitively do

I do not agree on this part, but I won't interfere that much in your works ;) :P .
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#19 aVENGER

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 01:20 AM

By using Cripple the thief won't gain any super-powers, or anything like that - he will simply try to target specific areas on an opponent, but that won't go without some downsides.


Not really. In 3E, neither Sneak Attack nor CS cause an attack roll penalty, yet they are described as targeted strikes. The only disadvantage which they hold is that you can not Sneak Attack with a ranged weapon from a distance greater than 30 feet, and that is completely reasonable IMO. In short, Sneak Attacks and Crippling Strikes depict the immense degree of skill with which the rogue strikes an opponent. The maximum damage effect in my ability is there to emulate just that.

A small penalty to THAC0 or damage is valid IMHO.


No. As I've already stated a while ago, I refuse to apply any form of THAC0 penally to Thieves in BG2. Their combat capabilities are already pathetic in 2E AD&D, and I strongly feel that they need no further penalizing from me in that department.

I do not agree on this part, but I won't interfere that much in your works


No problem T.G. your criticism has always been concise, constructive and highly appreciated. It just happens that we disagree over this particular matter.

#20 Littiz

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 05:38 AM

I'll probably publish a few small bugfix/balance updates in the next few weeks, as I always do when I make a major mod revision, but, in general this is most likely the end of my BG2 modding career. I might be willing to add your 'Use Scrolls' ability but that's really all there is to it.

I know you don't want to work on it much more, I just suggest some minor work to assure compatibility.
I'm not sure I can do everything on my side...

For example: since, among the rest, I'm adding "shadow" copies of all thief kits, I need to know which proficiencies they will have. So the easiest way would be to simply include in our mod your modifications to WEAPPROF.2DA, and apply them to the shadow kits as well (3 stars allowed to dualwielding).
While all the rest of your additions (Tranquillizer, Kit revisions ecc.) should be only available trough the Rogue Rebalancing Mod.

But there are other little problems: since we're placing specific tables for each Kit in the game, I have to change ALL the entries in the LUABBR file. Now, to avoid excessive mess, I've decided to follow the numeration used for the CLAB files, given in KITLIST.
Unfortunately this is slightly different from the original solution, which used numbers shifted by one.
We should try to coordinate in these "minor" issues, if possible :)

Use Scrolls seems to work, though it's not yet entirely completed, and it'll require testing.
Anyway, mages dualled *to* thief access the normal thief HLA table of course, but Use Scroll is greyed, that is: they already "know" it and may learn Scribe Scrolls without passing through Use Scrolls first.
Wizardslayers/Thieves will have both greyed. They won't be allowed to do magery in any way, won't even be duallable to mage :)
Ever forward, my darling wind...