21 replies to this topic

[Himself]

Is there any way to make the weapon styles (single weapon, sword&shield, dual wielding and two-handed weapons) grant a half attack per round?

I don't remember this being possible since there isn't an APR modifier column in stylbonu.2da, but then it might have become possible with some new changes from EE or some extra moding functionality that I don't know if it exists or not (hence why I'm asking).

Anyway, thanks for any help and tips! =]

[The Imp]

No.

[Himself]

But but... please?!?   

[The Imp]

But but... 

Invest to the weapon, and for kicks install an actual proficient weapon profs... aka edit the wspatck.2da to be completely OP when you have say 5 stars. For example instead of:

5   1   1 1 1 1 1  -2  -2  -2  -2  -2  -2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2

Make it:

5   2   2 2 2 2 2  -3  -3  -3  -3  -3  -3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 -4 -4 -4 -4 -4 -4 -4 4 4 4 4 4 4 -5 -5 -5 -5 -5 -5 5

For example.

[subtledoctor]

Forget about wspatck. Try this (EE v2.0+ only):

1) Append a row to splprot.2da for each of those three styles.

2) Apply a permanent spell with 3 effects using opcode 272 for repeating .EFFs happening every 6 seconds.

3) Each .EFF uses opcode 326 to check your proficiency level in the styles, and cast a secondary .SPL if you have 2 pips.

4) The secondary spells will grant +0.5 APR. There must be three separate ones.

5) Patch all shields with a 206 equipping effect protecting against the 2-hand and SWS secondary spells. Patch all 2-hand weapons with a 206 equipping effect protecting against the SWS and S&S secondary spells. Patch all 1-hand weapons with a 206 equipping effect protecting from the 2-hand secondary spell.

6) Profit.

OR...

1) Wait for me to do this and just use my mod.

All of the above is theoretical, but I think it might work. Trying it out is on my to-do list, but I'm backed up so I probably won't get to it until ~October/November. And, frankly, I'll probably only do it for Single-Weapon Style.

[The Imp]

So your solution to everything is to throw more effects at it ?

The old game would have stalled.

[Fiann of the Silver Hand]

I just wonder how it's going to stack with other APR modifiers.  Having the base apr as 2.5 (or whatever) is not treated the same in all instances as a base of 2, incremented to 2.5.  It's been over 10 years since this stuff was hashed out, mostly dealing with opcode overflows and Haste.  Will be cool to see how it turns out.  Will there be a portrait icon to let you know when it's in effect?

Edited by Fiann of the Silver Hand, 06 September 2016 - 02:23 AM.

[The Imp]

I just wonder how it's going to stack with other APR modifiers. Having the base apr as 2.5 (or whatever) is not treated the same in all instances as a base of 2, incremented to 2.5. It's been over 10 years since this stuff was hashed out, mostly dealing with opcode overflows and Haste.

Those problems should, should be over with the ToBEx'es fix ... should be.

[subtledoctor]

If half attacks were such a problem then they should have been phased out completely. As it is, "x/2 APR" litters the game. Is the effect from wspatck.2da functionally different from a 0.5 increment from opcode 1?

@Jarno my solution is to extend the possible benefits of weapon styles beyond the pathetically limited stylbonu.2da, in whatever way it is possible to do so. (What this would have done in the old engine is meaningless to discuss, because the old engine could not give us such capabilities. But, FWIW I have created similar "personal aura" 272 repeating .eff effects and they generally work fine on the old engine.)

If you don't like my method for adding APR to SWS, you really wouldn't like the method I devised to give DR for pips in shield-fighting... 😈

[The Imp]

If half attacks were such a problem then they should have been phased out completely. As it is, "x/2 APR" litters the game. Is the effect from wspatck.2da functionally different from a 0.5 increment from opcode 1?

As far as I know, it uses the very same opcode. As the negative values are the halfs, while the positives are the full number, up to 5. Aka the -4 is the 4.5 if there's nothing else effecting the value.

 

The shields solutions like-ing depends on if it works without flaws ... unlike the Refinements "Damage Resistance fix", which made the character nearly unmovable, nor command-able because it interrupted everything the char did with 6 second intervals to adjust the DR if you happened to get more than 85% damage resistance, breaking the whole system.

 

The old problem before the ToBEx fix was that if you reached too high bonus from a few sources, the value would wrap around and so the +4+2 attacks per around turned out to be 1, instead of max 5.

[subtledoctor]

Sounds like the old DR "fix" was running a script every round. I've several attempts to run scripts repeatedly, like to make stat bonuses more adaptable, and they were always very slow and fragile. Repeating .EFFs and stuff like bard songs, though, tend to work fine.

Also: if there is any problem with incrementing APR by 0.5 via effect, a simple solution could be to have the effect set APR to 3/2 instead. AFAIK all other APR effects should still work in that case.

[Fiann of the Silver Hand]

Sometimes I'm in "make it perfect" mode, and usually "it works 99% of the time" is all that's needed.

[The Imp]

Sometimes I'm in "make it perfect" mode, and usually "it works 99% of the time" is all that's needed.

"... and if we believe there's even a one percent chance that he is our enemy, we have to take it as an absolute certainty... and we have to destroy him." -should declare my opinion.

[Himself]

I'm a fan of megamods and gigainstalls, so the engine stalling (or behaving erratically) even in a potent PC is a known factor, there is only so much it can accomplish. Usually I try to do things the simple way, or avoid it completely when things require to overstress the engine via scripts checks or constant effects. That said I'm no expert, if someone tries to do something cool in a way that works, I'm willing to check it out!

[The Imp]

Well, first off ...

"... and if we believe there's even a one percent chance that he is our enemy, we have to take it as an absolute certainty... and we have to destroy him." -should declare my opinion.

Bwahaha

 

Secondly, subtledoctor, why isn't this implemented in BWS: Component 202: SBO: Full Strength form 2-Hand Weapons Only

 

It's kinda neat! But I don't see it in BWS SoB dropdown.

All the mod versions and component additions that are added to the mods need to be reported and to get them added to the BWS, just need to be requested here, so someone can try to check them out. Which subtledoctor probably hasn't done yet.

[FixTesteR]

All the mod versions and component additions that are added to the mods need to be reported and to get them added to the BWS, just need to be requested here, so someone can try to check them out. Which subtledoctor probably hasn't done yet.

Subtledoctor done it. Forthrightpharmacist grateful! How long does it usually take to implement it?

Edited by FixTesteR, 13 September 2016 - 06:17 AM.

[subtledoctor]

By the way, in case it wasn't clear, the new version of Scales of Balance (5.4), in addition to the "Full STR from 2-Hand Weaps" component, has also implemented the weapon style changes I described above:
- pips in 2HW now give +damage and +crit chance
- 2 pips in SWS now gives melee AC bonus and +1/2 APR
- 2 pips in S&S now has a chance to do a shield bash with a knockback effect
- DW full mastery is reduced from 3 pips to 2, you start at -4/-4 and end up at -2/0 (yes, off-hand has better thac0 than main hand)

EE engine only, v2.0+ required.

Edited by subtledoctor, 13 September 2016 - 10:53 AM.

[FixTesteR]

ALIEN, thanks for everything you do with BWS. Even though i still haven't been able to get a stable install

 

So, subtledoctor, I need EE for this. Oh, shame. Then I fold with my BGT preset It's a nice idea though. That with -1 to strength.

 

Thanks for help, guys.

[Himself]

That sounds pretty neat doctor, like most other features from your mod. I'll be sure to have a look, thanks!!

Edited by Himself, 18 September 2016 - 05:09 PM.