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Notes, Oddities and Possible Bugs in My BWP Game (Spoilers)


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#61 micbaldur

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Posted 11 May 2013 - 06:52 AM

Mercenary, here's those files you want.

 

 

 

Put those files in override (backup old ones if exists, just in case).

 

Update: Removed attached file.

 

Update: Add portraits.

 

 

 

Update: Removed attached file.


Edited by micbaldur, 11 May 2013 - 01:38 PM.

CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#62 micbaldur

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Posted 16 May 2013 - 07:24 AM

Well i get tired of waiting so i have decided to start playing again BWP expert-install + some mods.

 

This is BWP 11.4 and was made 15 of May 2013.

Note! These are possible bugs and at least oddities that i have encounter (some minor ones i probably have forgotten to add). Some of these have been probably reported earlier by someone else at somewhere? I cannot say that these are confirmed bugs because i don't have any knowledge of modding. Some of these are probably random hick-ups in my local install or come from my unusual play style "Super NPC Switching".

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.
Also changed install order for Lol's Rezmod, Boots of the Magi and Old Mods Pack because of overwriting issues.

Weidu Log:

Spoiler


Note! I use some mods that aren't in BWP. Mods are Shed's A Hero for All The Wrong Reasons mod, Moongaze's Crusader Pack mod, Icendoan's Forum-Only Items mod, Jamella's Diablo 2 Item Store mod, Exnem mod, TDD sin TDD mod, Isra NPC mod, I Shall Never Forget mod, Almateria's Restoration Project mod, Aurora ToB mod, Dace NPC mod, TeamBG Armor Pack, TeamBG Weapon Pack and 1pp v4.
 
These problems i have fixed before starting the game. I encountered these problems in my previous BWP games.

Note! Imprisonment spell: If party member gets imprisoned it erases tooltip scroll (no name or hitpoints) have to repair with NI. If CHARNAME is imprisoned then CTD (i have this bug for many years). Thats why i always use Geirthan Plate or some other protection when there's a chance to get imprisoned.

Here's Baldur.err for the crash:

Spoiler


Vecna: AAR003.ARE containers AA03CN00 and AA03CN01 have problems. Fixed locally.

Vecna: AAR036.ARE container Aa36cn01 has problem. Fixed locally.

Charli: Charli doesn't spawn at Slums (AR0400.BCS) script missing. Fixed locally.

Bolsa: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR0511 but tp2 compiles it to AR0702. Fixed locally.

Food And Herbal Mod: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR3000 but tp2 compiles it to AR1300. Fixed locally.

NEJ: NEJ v6.8 and v6.94 overwrites SoS travel triggers (Selence's quest) at Waukeen's Promenade (AR0700.ARE) to Sewers (SoS) (AR4201.ARE). Fixed locally.

Fishing for Trouble: YS0414.ARE container 3 have problem. Fixed locally.

NEJ: NEJ overwrites TDD and RoT scripts at AR0509.BCS. Fixed locally.

NEJ: End of Part 2 i did't get back to SoA part of the worldmap from Ulcaster (AR9799), every SoA areas are "Destination Unreachable". I can only go BG1 areas. Fixed locally.

NEJ: NEJ locks the door to Vulova Estate at Government with Govan's Key (KEYVULOV.ITM) and only way you get the key is to take the Bodhi offer instead of Gaylen Bayle or choices that Alternatives offers so those mods are broken.

SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 (AR4287) from Prison (AR4288) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Fixed locally.

RoT: Alissa loses her experience and levels when she rejoins at Spirit Soaring (wrong cre-file). Fixed locally.

BP: Kangaxx didn't have Boots of the Magi from Stuff of the Magi and Jade Burial Plate from Old Mods Pack because BP overwrites cre-file. Changed install order in bat-file.

Lol's Rezmod: Mae'Var didn't have Masa +2 as a loot. D0 Quest Pack component "Additional Shadow Thieves Content" overwrites cre-file. Changed install order in bat-file.

Tactics: Tactics mod overwrites AR1800.ARE breaking actors from Undying mod. It also break quest from Shard of Ice mod. Fixed locally.

TDD: TDD (Ellesime dialogue-file (SUELLE2.DLG)) breaks Ninde NPC soul restoring, Saerileth NPC marriage ceremony and restoring Deheriana (Kivan Mod). Only The Queen romantic encounter (RE) works. Sad that this can't be fixed (unless Hoppy makes comeback).

TDD: Ellesime did't give "Seldarine Amulet" like she says. Fixed locally.

Hessa NPC: Trade Way Merchant Camp Area (ARSU10) not in Worldmap. Fixed locally and made worldmap component. Hope it works ok.

RoT: Mysterious Cave (RA4006.ARE) Shadow doesn't give you Shadow's Mark. Fixed locally.

Ranger Stronghold: Mairyn doesn't give "Moon Dog Figurine" like she says. Fixed locally.

Fade NPC: "Firgraak's Tooth" missing (other items from other mods also) from loot of Firkraag probably incompability with Revised Battles mod. Try to "fix" locally.

Worldmap:  Druidic Circle (AR3587) from CtB is "under" Cloakwood Grove (AR8400). Fixed locally in WORLDMAP.WMP.

 

NEJ: There might be 3 cutscene problems in Halruaa (encountered earlier games) so i check these later (i have fixed those earlier).


Edited by micbaldur, 16 May 2013 - 07:25 AM.

CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#63 Leonardo Watson

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Posted 16 May 2013 - 10:59 PM

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.


Could you please direct me to the regarding comments?

Please give me your locally fixed files. I assume I can most of them apply correctly during installation with the BWP Installpack.



#64 The Imp

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Posted 17 May 2013 - 03:34 AM

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.
That recomendation dates back to the time the TS v7.04 came out, it's also not with any other major BWP mods like TDD, SOS etc. odd version of the v1.05 BGT reshufled with a stray setup-BGT.tp2 and and featuring majorly the not fixed BDTOBV168, not the BG2Fixpack... I promise you to have horrible terrors in that install...
Fixed locally.
Would you pleaase be a bit more specific... :devil:

Edited by The Imp, 17 May 2013 - 03:37 AM.

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.


#65 micbaldur

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Posted 17 May 2013 - 06:58 AM

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.


Could you please direct me to the regarding comments? 

Well Horred says it here if i understand correctly.
 
As for the Vlad recommendation it's from NEJ v6.91 readme. Qoute here:

*Note: If you wish to install TS, please do so prior to installation of NeJ2.

 

Please give me your locally fixed files. I assume I can most of them apply correctly during installation with the BWP Installpack. 

Well i don't know anything about modding :blink:  i fix my game with NI.

 

I could give you some fixed files (AREs and BAFs). But i don't know how to give you fixed DLG-files (edited triggers and actions) and some overwrited things in ARE-files.

 

Where is Lollorian when you need him. :P He has helped me a lot with my problems. :coolthumb:


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#66 micbaldur

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Posted 17 May 2013 - 07:02 AM

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.

That recomendation dates back to the time the TS v7.04 came out, it's also not with any other major BWP mods like TDD, SOS etc. odd version of the v1.05 BGT reshufled with a stray setup-BGT.tp2 and and featuring majorly the not fixed BDTOBV168, not the BG2Fixpack... I promise you to have horrible terrors in that install...

You mean i have terrors. If so bring it on i can handle everything... :ermm: maybe. :P

Fixed locally.

Would you pleaase be a bit more specific... :devil:

Maybe i could. :devil: Heh heh. :P


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#67 micbaldur

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Posted 17 May 2013 - 03:59 PM

Heh, i guessed right. :ROFL:

 

The moment i make BWP install and start playing new BP comes. :coolthumb:

 

Now i have to reconsider and re-install everything with new BP v1.81. :o

 

First i start making some test installs. :lol:


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#68 micbaldur

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Posted 19 May 2013 - 07:21 AM

Encounter minor problems at BWP expert install with new BP.

 

Decided to leave this to professionals and continue to play my 4 days old BWP install.

 

Well maybe later. :(


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#69 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 06:01 AM

BP: I can't open the container at Horred's Lair (AR8050, x 1900 y 755) in City Gates. It contains Wizard's Buckler +2.
 
Charli: Charli doesn't spawn at Slums (AR0400.BCS) script missing. Fixed locally.

Bolsa: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR0511 but tp2 compiles it to AR0702. Fixed locally.

Food And Herbal Mod: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR3000 but tp2 compiles it to AR1300. Fixed locally.

SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 (AR4287) from Prison (AR4288) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Fixed locally.

RoT: Alissa loses her experience and levels when she rejoins at Spirit Soaring (wrong cre-file). Fixed locally.

BP: Kangaxx didn't have Boots of the Magi from Stuff of the Magi and Jade Burial Plate from Old Mods Pack because BP overwrites cre-file. Changed install order in bat-file.

TDD: Ellesime did't give "Seldarine Amulet" like she says. Fixed locally.

Hessa NPC: Trade Way Merchant Camp Area (ARSU10) not in Worldmap. Fixed locally and made worldmap component. Hope it works ok.

RoT: Mysterious Cave (RA4006.ARE) Shadow doesn't give you Shadow's Mark. Fixed locally.

Ranger Stronghold: Mairyn doesn't give "Moon Dog Figurine" like she says. Fixed locally.

Worldmap:  Druidic Circle (AR3587) from CtB is "under" Cloakwood Grove (AR8400). Fixed locally in WORLDMAP.WMP.

 

Hi micbaldur :)

if it not bother you, can I know in what ways have you fixed locally the above mentioned bugs? :whistling:


Edited by ilot, 21 June 2013 - 06:12 AM.

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#70 micbaldur

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 07:03 AM

 
Hi micbaldur :)
if it not bother you, can I know in what ways have you fixed locally the above mentioned bugs? :whistling:

Well it's not bother so here's how i fixed those.

Use NI for most if these fixes.
 
BP: I can't open the container at Horred's Lair (AR8050, x 1900 y 755) in City Gates. It contains Wizard's Buckler +2.
AR8050.ARE:

Barrel 2: Change Lock difficulty, Trap detection difficulty and Trap removal difficulty to 90.
 
Charli: Charli doesn't spawn at Slums (AR0400.BCS) script missing. Fixed locally.
Pre-install fix here.

Add these lines to AR0400.BCS:
Spoiler

 
Bolsa: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR0511 but tp2 compiles it to AR0702. Fixed locally.
Pre-install fix here.
 
Add these lines to AR0511.BCS:
Spoiler

 
Food And Herbal Mod: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR3000 but tp2 compiles it to AR1300. Fixed locally.
Pre-install fix here.
 
Add these lines to AR3000.BCS:
Spoiler

 
SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 (AR4287) from Prison (AR4288) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Fixed locally.
 Re-fixing this later.
 
RoT: Alissa loses her experience and levels when she rejoins at Spirit Soaring (wrong cre-file). Fixed locally.
 Pre-install fix here.
 
RR3701.BCS:
Change block:
Spoiler

 
to:
Spoiler

 
Well actually you can change only one line.
 
BP: Kangaxx didn't have Boots of the Magi from Stuff of the Magi and Jade Burial Plate from Old Mods Pack because BP overwrites cre-file. Changed install order in bat-file.
This is probably fixed now because Horred updated BP recently.

Anyway you can add items to HLDEMI.CRE with NI.
 
TDD: Ellesime did't give "Seldarine Amulet" like she says. Fixed locally.
 This happens if you have installed TDD.
 
SUELLE2.DLG:

Action 13 and 14 add this line:
Spoiler

 
Hessa NPC: Trade Way Merchant Camp Area (ARSU10) not in Worldmap. Fixed locally and made worldmap component. Hope it works ok.
 Pre-install fix here.
 
RoT: Mysterious Cave (RA4006.ARE) Shadow doesn't give you Shadow's Mark. Fixed locally.
 MYSHDW01.DLG

Action 2: Change line:
Spoiler

 
to:
Spoiler

 
Ranger Stronghold: Mairyn doesn't give "Moon Dog Figurine" like she says. Fixed locally.
 MAIRYN.DLG

Action 13: Change line:
Spoiler

 
to:
Spoiler

 
Worldmap: Druidic Circle (AR3587) from CtB is "under" Cloakwood Grove (AR8400). Fixed locally in WORLDMAP.WMP.
WORLDMAP.WMP

Druidic Circle; Change Coordinate: X to 1422.

Edited by micbaldur, 21 June 2013 - 07:07 AM.

CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#71 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 08:34 AM

Oh, thank you :new_thumbs: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

a last thing: :whistling:

I no understand what do you mean :crying: "Re-fixing this later" about "SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 (AR4287) from Prison (AR4288) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Fixed locally."

 
Thanks!!!!


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#72 micbaldur

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 08:53 AM

Oh, thank you :new_thumbs: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No problem hope it helps. :D

a last thing: :whistling:
I no understand what do you mean :crying: "Re-fixing this later" about "SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 (AR4287) from Prison (AR4288) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Fixed locally."
 
Thanks!!!!

I mean that i found a problem in fix and i going to check it when i get to Soubar in my current BWP game.

Sadly though i just started the game from Candlekeep (i'm going to Nashkel next) so it's going to be many months before i get to Soubar. :(


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#73 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 09:09 AM

You helped me so much thanks :)

 

For SOS I will wait....:)

 

I would like to know if you have solved the following problem, because I fear me also will have it..... :shifty::

Fading Promises: Aidan didn't spawn after i did get the Fist of Amaunator. Have to do some global setting. Also i did get two Fist of Amaunator. Also spawning problems later at Athkatla. Had to do some manual work to progress.

 

 

Thanks   :cheers:

 



 


Edited by ilot, 21 June 2013 - 09:11 AM.

Italian mods tanslator!!!!


#74 micbaldur

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 09:20 AM

You helped me so much thanks :)
 
For SOS I will wait.... :)
 
I would like to know if you have solved the following problem, because I fear me also will have it..... :shifty::
Fading Promises: Aidan didn't spawn after i did get the Fist of Amaunator. Have to do some global setting. Also i did get two Fist of Amaunator. Also spawning problems later at Athkatla. Had to do some manual work to progress.
 
 
Thanks   :cheers:
 


 

Well maybe for the Underdark and Fist of Amaunator problem but i have to check it when i get there. Again after several months though. :(


CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#75 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 09:26 AM

Ok!!!! and thank you again for your help :)


Edited by ilot, 21 June 2013 - 09:48 AM.

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#76 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 09:48 AM

I have a doubt (the last I hope!) about bugs including "Pre-install fix", for example Charli:

 

I must install before the fix and after fix it manually using Near Infinity or I can  add only the lines using Near Infinity and then compiling the lines using Near Infinity?


Italian mods tanslator!!!!


#77 micbaldur

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 10:14 AM

I have a doubt (the last I hope!) about bugs including "Pre-install fix", for example Charli:

 

I must install before the fix and after fix it manually using Near Infinity or I can  add only the lines using Near Infinity and then compiling the lines using Near Infinity?

Sorry i probably wasn't clear about that.

 

Pre-install fix means that you have to overwrite original mod files with these files and then install mod. No fixing needed after that.

 

If you are fixing already installed game then use NI, edit and compile those files.

 

Only Hessa worldmap component requires re-installing, others you can edit to old BWP game.


Edited by micbaldur, 21 June 2013 - 10:15 AM.

CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#78 ilot

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 10:34 AM

Sorry because I not told you that my game is installed and I would like to fix the the bugs "ingame" !!!

Well, then I'll use NI, edit and compile those files (excluding for Hessa worldmap component) 

 

Thank for your time!! :)


Edited by ilot, 21 June 2013 - 10:36 AM.

Italian mods tanslator!!!!


#79 micbaldur

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 10:55 AM

I decided to start over and use recent BP v181-b4503. Everything installed just fine.

 

Note!  This is BWP 11.4 and was made 15 of June 2013.

These are possible bugs and at least oddities that i have encounter (some minor ones i probably have forgotten to add). Some of these have been probably reported earlier by someone else at somewhere? I cannot say that these are confirmed bugs because i don't have any knowledge of modding. Some of these are probably random hick-ups in my local install or come from my unusual play style "Super NPC Switching".

Note! Changed install order TS first and then NEJ. Recommended by Horred and Vlad.

Also changed install order for Lol's Rezmod, Boots of the Magi and Old Mods Pack because of overwriting issues.

Weidu Log:

Spoiler


Note! I use some mods that aren't in BWP. Mods are Shed's A Hero for All The Wrong Reasons mod, Moongaze's Crusader Pack mod, Icendoan's Forum-Only Items mod, Jamella's Diablo 2 Item Store mod, Exnem mod, TDD sin TDD mod, Isra NPC mod, I Shall Never Forget mod, Almateria's Restoration Project mod, Aurora ToB mod, Dace NPC mod, TeamBG Armor Pack, TeamBG Weapon Pack.

I also installed BP v181-b4503 and 1pp v4.

These problems i have fixed before starting the game. I encountered these problems in my previous BWP installs and checked these before i started to play.

Note! Imprisonment spell: If party member gets imprisoned it erases tooltip scroll (no name or hitpoints) have to repair with NI. If CHARNAME is imprisoned then CTD (i have this bug for many years). Thats why i always use Geirthan Plate or some other protection when there's a chance to get imprisoned.

Here's Baldur.err for the crash:
Spoiler


Vecna: AAR003.ARE containers AA03CN00 and AA03CN01 have problems. Fix here.


Vecna: AAR036.ARE container Aa36cn01 has problem. Fixed locally with DLTCEP.


Charli: Charli doesn't spawn at Slums (AR0400.BCS) script missing. Fix here.


Bolsa: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR0511 but tp2 compiles it to AR0702. Fix here.

Food And Herbal Mod: Bug in scripts. Script says area AR3000 but tp2 compiles it to AR1300. Fix here.

NEJ: NEJ v6.8 and v6.94 overwrites SoS travel triggers (Selence's quest) at Waukeen's Promenade (AR0700.ARE) to Sewers (SoS) (AR4201.ARE).

Added trigger to AR0700.ARE with these values:

Spoiler


Fishing for Trouble: YS0414.ARE container 3 have problem. Fix here.

NEJ: NEJ overwrites TDD and RoT scripts at AR0509.BCS.

Added these lines to AR0509.BCS:
Spoiler


NEJ: End of Part 2 i did't get back to SoA part of the worldmap from Ulcaster (AR9799), every SoA areas are "Destination Unreachable".

Added these lines to AR9799.BCS:

Spoiler


HROTHJ.DLG:

Action 133: Added this line:

Spoiler


NEJ: NEJ locks the door to Vulova Estate at Government with Govan's Key (KEYVULOV.ITM) and only way you get the key is to take the Bodhi offer instead of Gaylen Bayle or choices that Alternatives offers so that mod is broken.

SoS: I cannot enter to Guard Barracks Prison Level 2 from Prison (AR4287) even though Soubar Major says that CHARNAME can go to Lyrar's Hold through the Caves. Re-fixing this later.

RoT: Alissa loses her experience and levels when she rejoins at Spirit Soaring (wrong cre-file). Fix here.

Lol's Rezmod: Mae'Var didn't have Masa +2 as a loot. D0 Quest Pack component "Additional Shadow Thieves Content" overwrites cre-file. Changed install order in bat-file.

Tactics: Tactics mod overwrites AR1800.ARE breaking actors from Undying mod. It also break quest from Shard of Ice mod.

Added these lines to AR1800.BCS:
Spoiler


TDD: TDD (Ellesime dialogue-file (SUELLE2.DLG)) breaks Ninde NPC soul restoring, Saerileth NPC marriage ceremony and restoring Deheriana (Kivan Mod). Only The Queen romantic encounter (RE) works. Sad that this can't be fixed (unless Hoppy makes comeback).

TDD: Ellesime did't give "Seldarine Amulet" like she says. This problem is probably related to Ninde/Saerileth/Kivan problem above.

SUELLE2.DLG:

Action 13 and 14: Added this line:

Spoiler


Hessa NPC: Trade Way Merchant Camp Area (ARSU10) not in Worldmap. Fixed locally and made worldmap component here. Hope it works ok.


RoT: Mysterious Cave (RA4006.ARE) Shadow doesn't give you Shadow's Mark.

MYSHDW01.DLG:

 

Changed Action 2 from:

Spoiler

to:
Spoiler


Ranger Stronghold: Mairyn doesn't give "Moon Dog Figurine" like she says.

MAIRYN.DLG:
Changed Action 13 and 15 from:
Spoiler

to:
Spoiler


Fade NPC: "Firgraak's Tooth" missing (other items from other mods also) from loot of Firkraag probably incompability with Revised Battles mod. Trying to "fix" locally later.


Worldmap:  Druidic Circle (AR3587) from CtB is "under" Cloakwood Grove (AR8400). Fixed locally in WORLDMAP.WMP.


Eilistraee's Clearing and TS: Incompability at AR2401.BCS. "!Dead("Sola")" causes problems because in TS during Sime romance i kill Sola (SOLA.CRE) who is not Solaufein (i don't use Solaufein NPC mod).

Removed this line from AR2401.BCS:

Spoiler



These are bugs i encountered in current game so far.

BG1:

Infinity Animations component "BG1 Animations for NPCs": Kagain (KAGAIN4.CRE) causes CTD at Mercenary HQ (AR6753.ARE) in Beregost.

Here's KAGAIN4.CRE change-log:
Spoiler


Here's CRE-file:

Attached File  KAGAIN4.CRE   1.94K   213 downloads

BP Script problem: Shar-Teel (AR3200) stays hostile. She should change neutral and start talking. Fixed locally by changing BPWTRSGT.BCS to WTASIGHT.BCS from cre-file.


Edited by micbaldur, 22 June 2013 - 05:32 AM.

CHARNAMEs excellent adventures in the world of BWP expert-install here

 

Thanks to Leonardo Watson for making this possible


#80 The Imp

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 10:57 AM

...
That's quite enough specific... thanks. :devil:

Yep, Jarno Mikkola. my Mega Mod FAQ. Use of the BWS, and how to use it(scroll down that post a bit). 
OK, desert dweller, welcome to the sanity, you are free to search for the limit, it's out there, we drew it in the sand. Ouh, actually it was still snow then.. but anyways.